From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 09:19:40 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 09:19:40 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0YLQuNC/0LAgItC90LXQv9GA0LjRh9C10YHQsNC90L0=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0YvQtSDQvNGL0YHQu9C4IiAo0L3QtSDQvNC+0LgpICLQt9CwINCy0L4=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0L7QsdGJ0LUi?=
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFv-mCMFn8FO9E9=LZG1Exg51C_RRjGwP+JJ5xnP_BxXSQ@mail.gmail.com>

?????????? ????? ???????, https://habr.com/ru/post/560346/ ??????????
(??? ??????? ? reddit)

??? ????? ??????????? ? ????? ????????, ???????:

<quote>????? ????????????? ?????, ???????? ????? ????????? ????????, ?
??? ????????????????. ???, ???-??????, ??????????, ??????? ???? ??????
??????? ????????????. ????????, ???? ???? ?????-?? ????????????, ? ??
???????? ?? ???? (????????, ???? ????? ?????, ????? ????, 1? ?? ????,
???? ?? ??? ?????????????, ??? ? ????? ?????? ??????? ????).
? ????? ? ?????????????, ????????? ??????? ??????????? ?? ?????????? ?
???????? ?????.</quote>

...? ??, ??????????????? change management ????????? ?????? ? ??????.

??? ??? full-stack web developer ????? ????? ?????????. ? ????? ?????
????? 5 ??? ?? ?????????.

From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 09:29:39 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 09:29:39 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0YLQuNC/0LAgItC90LXQv9GA0LjRh9C10YHQsNC90L0=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0YvQtSDQvNGL0YHQu9C4IiAo0L3QtSDQvNC+0LgpICLQt9CwINCy0L4=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0L7QsdGJ0LUi?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFv-mCMFn8FO9E9=LZG1Exg51C_RRjGwP+JJ5xnP_BxXSQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFv-mCMFn8FO9E9=LZG1Exg51C_RRjGwP+JJ5xnP_BxXSQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFvck-rtwHV10gH_5ixC675R5FRGvJpCXpqozTroNwCMqw@mail.gmail.com>

? ???????????? ? ????????? ??? ???? ??????????? ?? ??????
https://old.reddit.com/r/ExperiencedDevs/comments/nmodyl/drunk_post_things_ive_learned_as_a_sr_engineer/gzq03ho/

???? ???? ?????? ???????? ?????

From alex at euro.net.ua  Tue Jun  1 09:50:52 2021
From: alex at euro.net.ua (Alexander V Soroka)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 09:50:52 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0YLQuNC/0LAgItC90LXQv9GA0LjRh9C10YHQsNC90L0=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0YvQtSDQvNGL0YHQu9C4IiAo0L3QtSDQvNC+0LgpICLQt9CwINCy0L7QvtCx?=
 =?utf-8?b?0YnQtSI=?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFv-mCMFn8FO9E9=LZG1Exg51C_RRjGwP+JJ5xnP_BxXSQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFv-mCMFn8FO9E9=LZG1Exg51C_RRjGwP+JJ5xnP_BxXSQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <569886785.20210601095052@euro.net.ua>

?????? !

???????? ????? !

? ?? ???????? ????? ?????? ?????? ??? ???? ????????,
? ????? ????????? (===):

* ??????? ???????? ???????? ??????? ?????????? ???????? ????????.

===  ???  ?  ?????????  ?????  ??????????? ??????????? ? "???????????"
???????  ?????  ??  ????????  ?  ???????????,  ??? "???-?? ??????", ??
??????? ???? ? ????? ??????? ?????????? ??????????? ??????!
??????  ???  ????  ???????  ???????  "??  ?  ?? ?????????? ? ???? ? ??
??????????   ??????",  ?  ?????,  ?????  ??  ?????????  ?????????  ???
??????????  ???????  ???? ?????? ???????? ? "??????????" ??? ??? ?????
???????  ??? ???? ? 10 ??? ? ????? ?? ?????????? ????? ??????? ??? ???
???????  ??  3-5  ???????,  ???  ??  ?????????? "????????? ?????????":
"?????... ? ????? ?? ??????????, ? ?? ???? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ? ?????
??  ????? ????? ???????. ??????? ?????? ??? ??? ???? ? 2 ???? ????????
? ??????? ?????? ?? ???? ???????? ?????? ?? ????... ?? ?? ???????? ???
????  ?????  ?????? ?? ???? ???????!".... ??????? ??? ???????? ?? ????
?????????????,   ??   ???????  ??  ????  "?????  ???  ?????  ?  ??????
???????????? ? ???????, ??? ??????? ??? ???????? ??????? ?? 1-2 ??????
?  ??  ?????? ??? ?? ?????? ?????????" :-) ...???? ????? ??????, ??? ?
???? ???????????.


*   ?????   ?   ??????   ???????,   ?   ???   ????????   ????????????,
????????????????? ? computer science. ? ???? ??????.

===   ?????????  ?????????!  ????????  ?????  ?????  ?????  ??????????
"???????????  ?????????"  ?  "????????"  :-) ??? ???? ??? ???????? ???
????? "????????????? ???????"...


*  ???  ????????  ??  ???????? ???????? ? ?? ??????????? ? ???? ??????
???????????????. ?????????? ? ?????? ?????? ?????????? ????????.

===  ?  ?????  ??????  ???  100% ?????????????... ?????? ??? ?????? ??
????????????,  ???  ???????  ????  ?????  ????????? ??????, ???? ?? ??
???????????  ???? ? ?????????? ???-????. ?? ? ?????????? ???-???? ????
??  ????  ???????????  (?????  ??????????  ?????????  ?.?.),  ????  ??
????????? ??????? ??? ??????????...  ????? ???? ? ????: ?????? ?? ????
??????  ????  ???  ???? ???? ? ?????? ? ???? ????? ???? ???????????? ?
???????? ?????. ?????? ? ???? "??? ???? ?? ?????" - ???? ? ??????.

* ??????? ?????????? ??????? ?????. ?????? ?????? ??, ??? ?? ??????????.

===  ...?  ??????  ?????????,  ???  ???  ???  ?? ????? ?? "???? ??? ??
?????????" ?? ????????? ?????????? :-) ??????? ?????, ???-??,
?????????? ??????? ????? ??? "???????????? ??????? ?????". :-)



Tuesday, June 1, 2021, 9:19:40 AM, Stesin stesin at gmail.com you wrote:
S> ?????????? ????? ???????, https://habr.com/ru/post/560346/ ??????????
S> (??? ??????? ? reddit)

S> ??? ????? ??????????? ? ????? ????????, ???????:

S> <quote>????? ????????????? ?????, ???????? ????? ????????? ????????, ?
S> ??? ????????????????. ???, ???-??????, ??????????, ??????? ???? ??????
S> ??????? ????????????. ????????, ???? ???? ?????-?? ????????????, ? ??
S> ???????? ?? ???? (????????, ???? ????? ?????, ????? ????, 1? ?? ????,
S> ???? ?? ??? ?????????????, ??? ? ????? ?????? ??????? ????).
S> ? ????? ? ?????????????, ????????? ??????? ??????????? ?? ?????????? ?
S> ???????? ?????.</quote>

S> ...? ??, ??????????????? change management ????????? ?????? ? ??????.

S> ??? ??? full-stack web developer ????? ????? ?????????. ? ????? ?????
S> ????? 5 ??? ?? ?????????.
S> _______________________________________________
S> uanog mailing list
S> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
S> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog


-- 
Best regards,
Alexander V Soroka       http://www.svr.ua/
AS106-RIPE
mailto:alex at euro.net.ua


From doka at funlab.cc  Tue Jun  1 11:00:13 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 11:00:13 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d735b04f-85a8-7961-1acc-5f5984e3e569@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFutBqa5ReyHooOKbm_Wp56oVqQnWTDtG8T-hrYQS18atg@mail.gmail.com>
 <804467ab-a8b8-42e4-76a9-8810c6bf931f@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>

? ?? ?? ????.

? ?? ????: ??, ??? ?? ???????? ???????????, ?????? ??????? ??????? ?? 
??????????????. ? ????????.

On 30.05.2021 00:37, Stesin wrote:
> ??, 20 ??? ???????? ???? ?????? ???????????. ? ?????? ??? ?? ?????,
> ???????? - ???????? ??????.
>
> (????? ?????? - ?????? ?? ??????? ? ??????? - ???????, ??? ?? ?????
> "??????". ? ? ???? ?? ????? ? ?????????? ???? ?? ??????. ?? ??? ???
> ??? ? ??????????, ??? ???? ??????.)
>
> On Tue, 25 May 2021 at 18:50, Volodymyr Litovka <doka at funlab.cc> wrote:
>> ??? ??????? ?? ????? ??????. ????????, ?????? ? ???????? hostmaster.ua ???? ???? ??????????, ???? ??? ?? ???????? ?????? ;-)
>>
>> On 25.05.2021 18:47, Stesin wrote:
>>
>> ?????? ?????????.
>>
>> On Tue, 25 May 2021 at 15:01, Volodymyr Litovka <doka at funlab.cc> wrote:
>>
>> ???????? ??? ???? ???????? ????? ??????????.
>>
>> ???????? ??? ????? ????????? ???? ?? ???????? ???? ?? ????? ???? :)
>>
>> --
>> Volodymyr Litovka
>>    "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

-- 
Volodymyr Litovka
   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

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From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 13:09:39 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 13:09:39 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d735b04f-85a8-7961-1acc-5f5984e3e569@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFutBqa5ReyHooOKbm_Wp56oVqQnWTDtG8T-hrYQS18atg@mail.gmail.com>
 <804467ab-a8b8-42e4-76a9-8810c6bf931f@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
 <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFsfQQv2RqynAerzb8ZCXtLrm=LNoQ+BUq_T1tBPUNuxwQ@mail.gmail.com>

> ? ?? ????: ??, ??? ?? ???????? ???????????, ?????? ??????? ??????? ?? ??????????????. ? ????????.

...? ????? ???? ? ??????? ?????? ????????? ?????...

From doka at funlab.cc  Tue Jun  1 13:11:21 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 13:11:21 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFsfQQv2RqynAerzb8ZCXtLrm=LNoQ+BUq_T1tBPUNuxwQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d735b04f-85a8-7961-1acc-5f5984e3e569@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFutBqa5ReyHooOKbm_Wp56oVqQnWTDtG8T-hrYQS18atg@mail.gmail.com>
 <804467ab-a8b8-42e4-76a9-8810c6bf931f@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
 <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFsfQQv2RqynAerzb8ZCXtLrm=LNoQ+BUq_T1tBPUNuxwQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <664cfd8d-5336-d1bb-a636-b813a45071da@funlab.cc>

???-?? ?? ????? ?? ?????? ???? ?? ????????? ???????? :-D

On 01.06.2021 13:09, Stesin wrote:
>> ? ?? ????: ??, ??? ?? ???????? ???????????, ?????? ??????? ??????? ?? ??????????????. ? ????????.
> ...? ????? ???? ? ??????? ?????? ????????? ?????...

-- 
Volodymyr Litovka
   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

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From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 14:01:34 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 14:01:34 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <664cfd8d-5336-d1bb-a636-b813a45071da@funlab.cc>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d735b04f-85a8-7961-1acc-5f5984e3e569@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFutBqa5ReyHooOKbm_Wp56oVqQnWTDtG8T-hrYQS18atg@mail.gmail.com>
 <804467ab-a8b8-42e4-76a9-8810c6bf931f@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
 <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFsfQQv2RqynAerzb8ZCXtLrm=LNoQ+BUq_T1tBPUNuxwQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <664cfd8d-5336-d1bb-a636-b813a45071da@funlab.cc>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFvSwbxZ0Uwk+uwfeyZiFvwGTtLwEyB=Cu1dXNRCDx3a7w@mail.gmail.com>

? ???, "????????? ????????" ??? ??????, ??? ??????????

?? ????? ???? ?? ?? 100% ????????? ????????????? ????????? ???????????
?????: "??, ??? ???? ??????? ???????????, ?????? ??????? ??????? ??
??????????????. ? ????????".

??? ????????, ????????????????? ???????? ?????? ???? ?????, ???????
??????? ? ?????? ????? ????????????? - ???????????? ? ???????????.
?????? ?? ??????? ??????? ??????????????? ??????????.

???-?? - ?? ????? ?????????? ??????? - ??????? ??????? ? ?????? ?????
?????????????, ?????????? ??????????, ????????? ??????????? ???????? -
???????????? ? ???????????. ?????? ?? ??????? ????? ???????????
????????. ??? ???? ???? ?????????? ????????? ??????-?? ? ????????
???????? ? ???????????? ????? ???? ????? ???????? ?? ?????????? ?????,
?????? ???????, ??????? ????????, ???????????

?????????, ????? ??? ????, ???? ??????? ??? ????????????, ?
??????????? ???? ? ????? ?????.

From alex at euro.net.ua  Tue Jun  1 14:29:25 2021
From: alex at euro.net.ua (Alexander V Soroka)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 14:29:25 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFvSwbxZ0Uwk+uwfeyZiFvwGTtLwEyB=Cu1dXNRCDx3a7w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com> 
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d735b04f-85a8-7961-1acc-5f5984e3e569@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFutBqa5ReyHooOKbm_Wp56oVqQnWTDtG8T-hrYQS18atg@mail.gmail.com>
 <804467ab-a8b8-42e4-76a9-8810c6bf931f@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
 <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFsfQQv2RqynAerzb8ZCXtLrm=LNoQ+BUq_T1tBPUNuxwQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <664cfd8d-5336-d1bb-a636-b813a45071da@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvSwbxZ0Uwk+uwfeyZiFvwGTtLwEyB=Cu1dXNRCDx3a7w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1057894997.20210601142925@euro.net.ua>

?????? !

Tuesday, June 1, 2021, 2:01:34 PM, Stesin stesin at gmail.com you wrote:
S> ??? ????????, ????????????????? ???????? ?????? ???? ?????, ???????
S> ??????? ? ?????? ????? ????????????? - ???????????? ? ???????????.
S> ?????? ?? ??????? ??????? ??????????????? ??????????.

??? ?? ???? ?? ???? ???????? ? ?????? ?? ???? ???? ??????. ???
"??????? ??????????????? ?????????" - ??? ? ????, ?? ????????? ? ?????,
?? ??? ??????????? - ?? ??? ?????? ????? ??.

? ?? ???? ? ???-?? ???? ????????? - ? ???????? ? ??????????? ??????? ?
????? ????? ?? ?????????.
??  ? ?? ? ???-????????? "?????? ????????? ?? ?????" ?????? ???? ?????
:-) ??? ??? ?? ???? ??? ??-?? !

S> ???-?? - ?? ????? ?????????? ??????? - ??????? ??????? ? ?????? ?????
S> ?????????????, ?????????? ??????????, ????????? ??????????? ???????? -
S> ???????????? ? ???????????. ?????? ?? ??????? ????? ???????????
S> ????????. ??? ???? ???? ?????????? ????????? ??????-?? ? ????????
S> ???????? ? ???????????? ????? ???? ????? ???????? ?? ?????????? ?????,
S> ?????? ???????, ??????? ????????, ???????????

????????? ? ??????? ??? ?? ??? ?????? ???? "?? ???????".
?? ?? ? ? ??????????. ?? "?????????? ??? ??????" ?????, ?? ?????.


-- 
Best regards,
Alexander V Soroka       http://www.svr.ua/
AS106-RIPE
mailto:alex at euro.net.ua


From doka at funlab.cc  Tue Jun  1 14:29:36 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 14:29:36 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFvSwbxZ0Uwk+uwfeyZiFvwGTtLwEyB=Cu1dXNRCDx3a7w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d735b04f-85a8-7961-1acc-5f5984e3e569@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFutBqa5ReyHooOKbm_Wp56oVqQnWTDtG8T-hrYQS18atg@mail.gmail.com>
 <804467ab-a8b8-42e4-76a9-8810c6bf931f@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
 <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFsfQQv2RqynAerzb8ZCXtLrm=LNoQ+BUq_T1tBPUNuxwQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <664cfd8d-5336-d1bb-a636-b813a45071da@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvSwbxZ0Uwk+uwfeyZiFvwGTtLwEyB=Cu1dXNRCDx3a7w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <d6a333da-56f4-44c7-bc30-cebcabd98165@funlab.cc>

On 01.06.2021 14:01, Stesin wrote:
> ? ???, "????????? ????????" ??? ??????, ??? ??????????
>
> ?? ????? ???? ?? ?? 100% ????????? ????????????? ????????? ???????????
> ?????: "??, ??? ???? ??????? ???????????, ?????? ??????? ??????? ??
> ??????????????. ? ????????".
>
> ??? ????????, ????????????????? ???????? ?????? ???? ?????, ???????
> ??????? ? ?????? ????? ????????????? - ???????????? ? ???????????.
> ?????? ?? ??????? ??????? ??????????????? ??????????.

????? ?????? ???? ??? ????????, ??? ?????? ????? ?? ???????.

? ?? ??????????, ????? ???????? ???? ??? ??????? ??? "??????? 
???????????????" ;-)

-- 
Volodymyr Litovka
   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

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From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 14:35:39 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 14:35:39 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0YLQuNC/0LAgItC90LXQv9GA0LjRh9C10YHQsNC90L0=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0YvQtSDQvNGL0YHQu9C4IiAo0L3QtSDQvNC+0LgpICLQt9CwINCy0L4=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0L7QsdGJ0LUi?=
In-Reply-To: <569886785.20210601095052@euro.net.ua>
References: <CAGNmsFv-mCMFn8FO9E9=LZG1Exg51C_RRjGwP+JJ5xnP_BxXSQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <569886785.20210601095052@euro.net.ua>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFsbMMXS_JtPTJ+_Lo5skhjSOo=TDaiCQ6aNpy57zNqSJQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 1 Jun 2021 at 09:51, Alexander V Soroka <alex at euro.net.ua> wrote:
>
> ?????? !

??????-??????!

> ???????? ????? !

??? ;)

> ===  ???  ?  ?????????  ?????  ??????????? ??????????? ? "???????????"
> ???????  ?????  ??  ????????  ?  ???????????,  ??? "???-?? ??????", ??
...
> ?  ??  ?????? ??? ?? ?????? ?????????" :-) ...???? ????? ??????, ??? ?
> ???? ???????????.

????????, ??? ??? ?? ?????????? ? ?????? ???????????? ? ????? ??
???????! ???? "????????", ?? ?? ?? ??? ?? ???? ??????, ? ?? ??
????????? ???????.

?? ??? ????????? ??? ???????? ??? ????????? ??? ??????? ? ???????,
??????? ??? ????? ??? ??????? ? ????????, ?????????????? ?????? ??
??????? ? ????? ????????? ??????, ??? ??? ??????? ?? ????????? "???
????? ??? ?????? ? ?? ???????". ??? ????? ?????? ?????? ??, ??? ???
???? ??? ???????, ? ??????? ?? ?? ???????.

?? ?? ??? - ???, ??????? ????????? ??????? ??????, ??????? ? ??, ?????
??????? ?????????????? ?? ?????? ??????????

> ===  ?  ?????  ??????  ???  100% ?????????????... ?????? ??? ?????? ??
> ????????????,  ???  ???????  ????  ?????  ????????? ??????,

...? ??? ?????? ?? ??????????? ????? ??????????? ???????, ?? ??????? ?? ???????.

? ?????? ??? ?????? ????? ?? ???????? ? ?????????, ???? ??????????.

From vladimir.sharun at ukr.net  Tue Jun  1 14:41:01 2021
From: vladimir.sharun at ukr.net (Vladimir Sharun)
Date: Tue, 01 Jun 2021 14:41:01 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFvSwbxZ0Uwk+uwfeyZiFvwGTtLwEyB=Cu1dXNRCDx3a7w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d735b04f-85a8-7961-1acc-5f5984e3e569@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFutBqa5ReyHooOKbm_Wp56oVqQnWTDtG8T-hrYQS18atg@mail.gmail.com>
 <804467ab-a8b8-42e4-76a9-8810c6bf931f@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
 <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFsfQQv2RqynAerzb8ZCXtLrm=LNoQ+BUq_T1tBPUNuxwQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <664cfd8d-5336-d1bb-a636-b813a45071da@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvSwbxZ0Uwk+uwfeyZiFvwGTtLwEyB=Cu1dXNRCDx3a7w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1622547321.156660000.5ymwm60b@frv53.fwdcdn.com>

???? ????????, ??????????????.

1 ?????? 2021, 14:02:12, ??? "Stesin" <stesin at gmail.com>:

? ???, "????????? ????????" ??? ??????, ??? ??????????

?? ????? ???? ?? ?? 100% ????????? ????????????? ????????? ???????????
?????: "??, ??? ???? ??????? ???????????, ?????? ??????? ??????? ??
??????????????. ? ????????".

??? ????????, ????????????????? ???????? ?????? ???? ?????, ???????
??????? ? ?????? ????? ????????????? - ???????????? ? ???????????.
?????? ?? ??????? ??????? ??????????????? ??????????.

???-?? - ?? ????? ?????????? ??????? - ??????? ??????? ? ?????? ?????
?????????????, ?????????? ??????????, ????????? ??????????? ???????? -
???????????? ? ???????????. ?????? ?? ??????? ????? ???????????
????????. ??? ???? ???? ?????????? ????????? ??????-?? ? ????????
???????? ? ???????????? ????? ???? ????? ???????? ?? ?????????? ?????,
?????? ???????, ??????? ????????, ???????????

?????????, ????? ??? ????, ???? ??????? ??? ????????????, ?
??????????? ???? ? ????? ?????.
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From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 14:41:37 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 14:41:37 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <1057894997.20210601142925@euro.net.ua>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d735b04f-85a8-7961-1acc-5f5984e3e569@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFutBqa5ReyHooOKbm_Wp56oVqQnWTDtG8T-hrYQS18atg@mail.gmail.com>
 <804467ab-a8b8-42e4-76a9-8810c6bf931f@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
 <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFsfQQv2RqynAerzb8ZCXtLrm=LNoQ+BUq_T1tBPUNuxwQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <664cfd8d-5336-d1bb-a636-b813a45071da@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvSwbxZ0Uwk+uwfeyZiFvwGTtLwEyB=Cu1dXNRCDx3a7w@mail.gmail.com>
 <1057894997.20210601142925@euro.net.ua>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFvMNJyppNa-JB5Ut2ooCms2czf07DF_6VG0W29ThhLyeA@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 1 Jun 2021 at 14:29, Alexander V Soroka <alex at euro.net.ua> wrote:
>
> ?????? !

??????-??????!

> Tuesday, June 1, 2021, 2:01:34 PM, Stesin stesin at gmail.com you wrote:
> S> ??? ????????, ????????????????? ???????? ?????? ???? ?????, ???????
> S> ??????? ? ?????? ????? ????????????? - ???????????? ? ???????????.
> S> ?????? ?? ??????? ??????? ??????????????? ??????????.
>
> ??? ?? ???? ?? ???? ???????? ? ?????? ?? ???? ???? ??????. ???
> "??????? ??????????????? ?????????" - ??? ? ????, ?? ????????? ? ?????,
> ?? ??? ??????????? - ?? ??? ?????? ????? ??.

"??? ?????!" - ??? ??????????? ???????? ? ???????????????? ?????????,
????????? ???????????? ??????????? ? ?????? ??????????, ??. ? ??? ???
? ???????? ?????? ?????, ???????? ?????, ?????? ??? ????.

> ? ?? ???? ? ???-?? ???? ????????? - ? ???????? ? ??????????? ??????? ?
> ????? ????? ?? ?????????.

??? ????????, ???? ?? ? ??? ?????????. ?????? ??????? ????????????, ??
??? ???????????? ?? ??????. ?????? ???? - ?????? ???? ;)

> S> ??? ???? ???? ?????????? ????????? ??????-?? ? ????????
> S> ???????? ? ???????????? ????? ???? ????? ???????? ?? ?????????? ?????,
> S> ?????? ???????, ??????? ????????, ???????????
>
> ????????? ? ??????? ??? ?? ??? ?????? ???? "?? ???????".
> ?? ?? ? ? ??????????. ?? "?????????? ??? ??????" ?????, ?? ?????.

????????. ? ?????? ??? ??????? ??????????, ?????? ? ????? ???????,
??????? ?? ???????? "??????? ???????????" ?????????????????
??????????? ????-2, ??? ???????? ? ?????????? ??????????? ??????????
?????????? ???????? ??????????? ???????????. ????? ?? ???????????

From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 14:44:50 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 14:44:50 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <d6a333da-56f4-44c7-bc30-cebcabd98165@funlab.cc>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <d735b04f-85a8-7961-1acc-5f5984e3e569@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFutBqa5ReyHooOKbm_Wp56oVqQnWTDtG8T-hrYQS18atg@mail.gmail.com>
 <804467ab-a8b8-42e4-76a9-8810c6bf931f@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvLN1buiELeHoPKqfRcrr2TBxNz-MV+jYw+Z7XTqUfbhA@mail.gmail.com>
 <de278af7-212d-aad5-4e7f-0ac4b47b745e@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFsfQQv2RqynAerzb8ZCXtLrm=LNoQ+BUq_T1tBPUNuxwQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <664cfd8d-5336-d1bb-a636-b813a45071da@funlab.cc>
 <CAGNmsFvSwbxZ0Uwk+uwfeyZiFvwGTtLwEyB=Cu1dXNRCDx3a7w@mail.gmail.com>
 <d6a333da-56f4-44c7-bc30-cebcabd98165@funlab.cc>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFtZhcMR3HtpKWaWhUUzM=9s01Us4-NRkecV-5r1x=zsWw@mail.gmail.com>

> ? ?? ??????????, ????? ???????? ???? ??? ??????? ??? "??????? ???????????????" ;-)

? ????? ???? - ???, ???????? - ??. ? ?? ????? ????????, ? ???? ?
????????? ?????????? ?????? ?? ? "????" ?????, ? ? ????? ??????
"??????" ?????, ?????????? ??????? ??????????? ??????????,  ??????? ??
????? ??????????? ??? ???????. ???? ?????????, ?? "??????
????????????? ?????" ???? ????????? ?? ??????? ????????? ???.

??? ??? ? ????????? ?? ???????, ??.

From alex at euro.net.ua  Tue Jun  1 14:53:04 2021
From: alex at euro.net.ua (Alexander V Soroka)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 14:53:04 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0YLQuNC/0LAgItC90LXQv9GA0LjRh9C10YHQsNC90L0=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0YvQtSDQvNGL0YHQu9C4IiAo0L3QtSDQvNC+0LgpICLQt9CwINCy0L7QvtCx?=
 =?utf-8?b?0YnQtSI=?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFsbMMXS_JtPTJ+_Lo5skhjSOo=TDaiCQ6aNpy57zNqSJQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFv-mCMFn8FO9E9=LZG1Exg51C_RRjGwP+JJ5xnP_BxXSQ@mail.gmail.com> 
 <569886785.20210601095052@euro.net.ua>
 <CAGNmsFsbMMXS_JtPTJ+_Lo5skhjSOo=TDaiCQ6aNpy57zNqSJQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1835218252.20210601145304@euro.net.ua>

?????? !

Tuesday, June 1, 2021, 2:35:39 PM, Stesin stesin at gmail.com you wrote:
S> ????????, ??? ??? ?? ?????????? ? ?????? ???????????? ? ????? ??
S> ???????! ???? "????????", ?? ?? ?? ??? ?? ???? ??????, ? ?? ??
S> ????????? ???????.
S> ?? ??? ????????? ??? ???????? ??? ????????? ??? ??????? ? ???????,
S> ??????? ??? ????? ??? ??????? ? ????????, ?????????????? ?????? ??
S> ??????? ? ????? ????????? ??????, ??? ??? ??????? ?? ????????? "???
S> ????? ??? ?????? ? ?? ???????". ??? ????? ?????? ?????? ??, ??? ???
S> ???? ??? ???????, ? ??????? ?? ?? ???????.

?? ??? ?? ?? ????.
????? ?? ????? ???? ???? ????????.
??? ??? ???????? "??? ??? ?????".

? ?????????? ????? ????? - ?? ?? ??????????.
???  ?????????  ???  ??? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ?? ???? ??????? - ?? "????
???????" ?????, ?? ??? ??? ?????? ? ?? ?????.

S> ?? ?? ??? - ???, ??????? ????????? ??????? ??????, ??????? ? ??, ?????
S> ??????? ?????????????? ?? ?????? ??????????

?????????  ?  ?  ???  ??????  ??  ????? - ? ???? ??? ?????????? ??????
??????????, ??? ?? ??? ??? ?????-?? "??????? ???????" ?????????
??????, ?????? ???? ??????, ? ???????? ??? ???? ?????????????? :) ? ??
?????? ??? ????? ?????...  ?????? ????????? ???????? :-)

????   ????????   "?   ?????????"  ??  ??????  "????????  ?  ????????"
?????????????  ???  ???  ???  ?????? ?????? ? ??????? ??????????, ? ??
?????  ?  ???????????  ?????  ????? ??????? ??? ????? ?????????????, ?
????? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ????? ??????.
??? ? ?????????, ??? ?? ? ???? ????? ????????? 20 ?????? ???????? :-)

?????? ???????? ? ??????? ?????? ??????????, ????? ??? ??? ???????????
??  ????????.  ????????  ??  ????, ? ?? ??? ??? ? ?? ????? ??????. ? ???
????????? ???-?? ?????????? - ??? ????? ? ??? ?????? ??????????? ? ???
??? ??? ? ????? ??????.

? ???? ????? ??????????? ?? ??????? "?????", ????????? ???? ????????? :)
??? ?????????? ??????????? ?????? "??????".

??????:  "...  ??????  ??????  ??  ???????  ??  ?? ?????????? ????????
????????????  ?  ?????  ??????????????  ?????????????  ???  ?? ???????
???????.  ????????,  ????????? ? ?????? ???????????? ?????????? ??????
?????  ??  ??????  ?????????? ?? ?????? ??????, ?? ? ?????????? ?????,
?????????? ? ???? ??????????? ???????? ?????. ..."
???????:  ??????  ??? ?? ?? ???????????? ??????? ??? ???? ?????????? ?
??????,  ?  ??  ???  ??  ????  ?  ???? ??????????, ? ???? ? ??????????
????????.

???  ???  ?  ????? ?????? ?? ??? ??? ?? ??? ????? :) "?????? ?? ?????? ??".

...???  ??? ?????????, ?? ??? ???? ?????? ? ????? ? "??????" ?????? ?????
???? ?? ?????????? ?????????? ? :) ? ??? ????? ????? ?


-- 
Best regards,
Alexander V Soroka       http://www.svr.ua/
AS106-RIPE
mailto:alex at euro.net.ua


From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 15:19:52 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 15:19:52 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0YLQuNC/0LAgItC90LXQv9GA0LjRh9C10YHQsNC90L0=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0YvQtSDQvNGL0YHQu9C4IiAo0L3QtSDQvNC+0LgpICLQt9CwINCy0L4=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0L7QsdGJ0LUi?=
In-Reply-To: <1835218252.20210601145304@euro.net.ua>
References: <CAGNmsFv-mCMFn8FO9E9=LZG1Exg51C_RRjGwP+JJ5xnP_BxXSQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <569886785.20210601095052@euro.net.ua>
 <CAGNmsFsbMMXS_JtPTJ+_Lo5skhjSOo=TDaiCQ6aNpy57zNqSJQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1835218252.20210601145304@euro.net.ua>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFtrM_z_9HjYgTxUbTiYQURGMqTMqo_YUrGmhKN_RC515A@mail.gmail.com>

??????-??????!

On Tue, 1 Jun 2021 at 14:53, Alexander V Soroka <alex at euro.net.ua> wrote:
> S> ??????? ? ????? ????????? ??????, ??? ??? ??????? ?? ????????? "???
> S> ????? ??? ?????? ? ?? ???????". ??? ????? ?????? ?????? ??, ??? ???
> S> ???? ??? ???????, ? ??????? ?? ?? ???????.
>
> ?? ??? ?? ?? ????.
> ????? ?? ????? ???? ???? ????????.
> ??? ??? ???????? "??? ??? ?????".

??, ????? ???, ??? ???? ????????, ? ???? ??? ? ?? ??????? - ? ????
??????? ?? ??? ???? ? ??? ????????? 3-5 ???????, ??? ? 1993 ????.
?????? ? ?????? ? ?????????? ??? ????? ??????? ? ??????? ????? - ???
??????? ?????????? ???? ???????????? ????? ???????. ? ????? ??????
??????, ??? ???? ???? ? ?? ????????, "??? ??? ?????", ?? ? ?????????
????????? ??????, ???? ?????? ? ?? ????? ?????? ??? ????, ???????????
?? ????????? ? ?????? ????????? "??? ? ???? ??? ???????" - ???
????????? ???????. ??????? ?????????.

? ??? ?????????????? ??????????????? ????????? ??????????? "? ??????
?? ?????" ???????????? ????????, ????????... ? ??? ????????? ???? ???
?????? ? ????????, ?? ?? ?????????, ? ????????????? ???????.

> ? ?????????? ????? ????? - ?? ?? ??????????.
> ???  ?????????  ???  ??? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ?? ???? ??????? - ?? "????
> ???????" ?????, ?? ??? ??? ?????? ? ?? ?????.

?? ? "?"(???????) ??? ??? ??? ????? ? ???? ??? ????????, ???????? ??
????? ??? ???????? ??????.

> S> ?? ?? ??? - ???, ??????? ????????? ??????? ??????, ??????? ? ??, ?????
> S> ??????? ?????????????? ?? ?????? ??????????
>
> ?????????  ?  ?  ???  ??????  ??  ????? - ? ???? ??? ?????????? ??????
> ??????????, ??? ?? ??? ??? ?????-?? "??????? ???????" ?????????
> ??????, ?????? ???? ??????, ? ???????? ??? ???? ?????????????? :) ? ??
> ?????? ??? ????? ?????...  ?????? ????????? ???????? :-)

???? ?? ??????, ??? ???????? ????????? - ??????? ??? ? ????????, ???.
?? ?????? ????????? ?????, ?????? ??? ????????.

????, ??? ?????? ... ?? ?????? ??? ?????????? ? ??-????????????
??????? ?? ????????, ???, ???????... ;)

> ????   ????????   "?   ?????????"  ??  ??????  "????????  ?  ????????"
> ?????????????  ???  ???  ???  ?????? ?????? ? ??????? ??????????, ? ??
> ?????  ?  ???????????  ?????  ????? ??????? ??? ????? ?????????????, ?
> ????? ??? ???? ??? ?????? ????? ??????.
> ??? ? ?????????, ??? ?? ? ???? ????? ????????? 20 ?????? ???????? :-)

???? ? ???? ???? ????? ????????. ???????, ??? ??????-?? ? ????? ??????
????????? ? ??????? ;)

> ?????? ???????? ? ??????? ?????? ??????????, ????? ??? ??? ???????????
> ??  ????????.

???, ????. ??? ????? ????????? ????? ?? ??????? ??? ???? (??????
????????, ???). ? ??? ????????? ?????? ??? ????? ?????? ? ???? ?????,
??? ?????? ?? ??? ??? ?????????, ??? ?? ? ??? ?????...

> ???  ???  ?  ????? ?????? ?? ??? ??? ?? ??? ????? :) "?????? ?? ?????? ??".

????? ?? ?????? ? ???? ???????, ??? ;)

> ...???  ??? ?????????, ?? ??? ???? ?????? ? ????? ? "??????" ?????? ?????
> ???? ?? ?????????? ?????????? ? :) ? ??? ????? ????? ?

? ???? ???????????? ?????? ???????? ? ???? ??????????? ?????, ???????
????? ???? ?? ???????? ????? ??????.

From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 15:25:15 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 15:25:15 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JXRgdGC0Ywg0LDQu9GM0YLQtdGA0L3QsNGC0LjQstCw?=
	=?utf-8?b?ISDQo9GC0LrQuCEgUmU6INCX0LDQvNC10L3QsCDQtNC70Y8gSmlyYQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <33567271-aa13-424f-893c-75477834c394@Spark>
References: <1384966f-ba67-48e1-8d23-6d0e3099621e@Spark>
 <0f8c947c-6cce-49c8-abc3-196afa6dd96d@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFubs_pwje+pqxdcTO1fnbB76DgoLOWGyzj6AXYB6NvB9A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFs=rO1UcNzvgOT4pug4Rxj72gySwx=_m39zvPPUTrky7g@mail.gmail.com>
 <33567271-aa13-424f-893c-75477834c394@Spark>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFs7etm_q5m5++F-u-b_oCYn4bs572+8Dcp5CDXfYGwfSw@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 25 May 2021 at 19:49, Maksym Tulyuk <maksym at tulyuk.com> wrote:
>
> ??????? ?? ?????!

?? ?? ?? ??? :)

> ??? ?????????, ??? ???????? ??????? ???? ????? :)

??? ?????? ? ???????, ???? ?? ??????? ???? ? ? ?????? ??? ??????? :)
:) ? ?????? ????, ??? ? GitHub & GitLab ??? ??? ???? ??? ??? ? ???
???? ???, ? ?????? ?????????? ??????, ?.?. ?????? ?? ????????????.

> ?? ???????? ???????? ? Agile Board ??? Scrum Master & Product Owner. ?? ??????? ??????? - ???? ?1 ? ???????? Product Owner ? ?????????? ????????? ?? ????? Daily Standup.

????? ? ??? ?? ????? board ????? ? GitLab, ?? ?? ??????? ??? ?????????

From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 18:37:31 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 18:37:31 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JrQsNC20LXRgtGB0Y8sINC80Ysg0L3QsNC60LDQvdGD?=
	=?utf-8?b?0L3QtSDQs9GA0LDQvdC00LjQvtC30L3QvtCz0L4g0YjRg9GF0LXRgNCw?=
	=?utf-8?b?Li4uINC/0YDQuNCy0LXRgiBJbnRlbC4uLg==?=
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFtcFprrZYrG8UBYzfGhSsR4t6ng98rcNyM2SE2GQiezjQ@mail.gmail.com>

https://habr.com/ru/company/cloud4y/blog/560438/

???-?? ??????? ??? ??? ????????.

From netch at netch.kiev.ua  Tue Jun  1 18:53:07 2021
From: netch at netch.kiev.ua (Valentin Nechayev)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 18:53:07 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JrQsNC20LXRgtGB0Y8sINC80Ysg0L3QsNC60LDQvdGD?=
 =?utf-8?b?0L3QtSDQs9GA0LDQvdC00LjQvtC30L3QvtCz0L4g0YjRg9GF0LXRgNCwLi4u?=
 =?utf-8?b?INC/0YDQuNCy0LXRgiBJbnRlbC4uLg==?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFtcFprrZYrG8UBYzfGhSsR4t6ng98rcNyM2SE2GQiezjQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFtcFprrZYrG8UBYzfGhSsR4t6ng98rcNyM2SE2GQiezjQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20210601155307.GN633539@netch.kiev.ua>

hi,

 Tue, Jun 01, 2021 at 18:37:31, stesin wrote about "[uanog] ???????, ?? ???????? ???????????? ??????... ?????? Intel...": 

> https://habr.com/ru/company/cloud4y/blog/560438/
> ???-?? ??????? ??? ??? ????????.

??? ???? ????????? ???????? ????? - ????????.
??? ?? ???????: endbr32, endbr64 ?????? ???? ?????? ????? NOP, ?? ???
? ????? ?? ??????????????? (?????? ?????? ???????? ???????????? ?
Intel ? AMD. ?? ????, ??? ? ????????? ??????? ????? ????????? x86.)
?? ????? ?? ????? ????? ???-?? ????? - ???? ??. ?????? ?? ??????
??????????????????? ?????????? ??????? ????????? ???????????
?????????, ??? ? ?????? ?????? ????????? ????????? ? ???.

(??? ???????: ? ?????? 2010 AMD ????? ??????? MSR ??? ??????? ? ??????
? ???? ?????? ?? ??????????? ?????????? ????????? ? edx. ??? ??????
??????????? ???-?? ???????? - ????????? ? ??? ?????????, ? ???????.)


-netch-

From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 18:57:57 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 18:57:57 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, 25 May 2021 at 21:05, Maksym Tulyuk <maksym at tulyuk.com> wrote:
>
> ?? ? ????? ???????????, ??? ??? ???? ????? ??????? ?? ?????????? ?, ???????, ??????? networking, ??? ?? ????????? 100% ?????????? ????

????? "??????????" (?????? ? ????. testing) ? ??????? ????? ??????,
??? "?????????".

????????? ?????????? ?? ????????? ?????????. ???? ????????? ??? ?
???????, ?? ??? ?? "?????????", ? ????????.

????????? ?????? ???? ?????: ?????????? (unit testing, load test, ...)
? ??????????? (integration testing).

? ???????: ????????? ?????????? ?? ???????????? ???????????. ???? ???
??????????????? ??????????, ?????????? ????????? ????????? ?????????
?? ???????????? ????.

?????:
- ??? ?????????? - ??? ????????? ?????????,
- ??? ????????? - ??? ?????????,
- ??? ????????? - ??? ????????? ????????? ? ???????? ????????, ?? ????
? ??? ?? ??? ??? ??????? ??????? ?? ??????? ????? ???????????

From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 19:01:47 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 19:01:47 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JrQsNC20LXRgtGB0Y8sINC80Ysg0L3QsNC60LDQvdGD?=
	=?utf-8?b?0L3QtSDQs9GA0LDQvdC00LjQvtC30L3QvtCz0L4g0YjRg9GF0LXRgNCw?=
	=?utf-8?b?Li4uINC/0YDQuNCy0LXRgiBJbnRlbC4uLg==?=
In-Reply-To: <20210601155307.GN633539@netch.kiev.ua>
References: <CAGNmsFtcFprrZYrG8UBYzfGhSsR4t6ng98rcNyM2SE2GQiezjQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <20210601155307.GN633539@netch.kiev.ua>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFshphR+Ha7vbTWsFSMQtaXp-+0EXQ-YUKMfF_uFEjtUNA@mail.gmail.com>

???????, ???? ?? ??????? ???-?? ??? ???? ??? ???...

(??????, ? ??? ??? ??? meltdown/spectre, ?????? ??????? ? ?????
???????? ????????? mitigations, ??????????? ?????????????????? CPU ??
????? - ? ??????????-?? ???????? ???? ????? ????? - ???????? ???????
??, ? ???????, ??? "?? ????????" ?? ????????, ??? ?? ?? ????, ?? ????
?????????-?? ?????)

On Tue, 1 Jun 2021 at 18:53, Valentin Nechayev <netch at netch.kiev.ua> wrote:
>

From vladimir.sharun at ukr.net  Tue Jun  1 19:15:29 2021
From: vladimir.sharun at ukr.net (Vladimir Sharun)
Date: Tue, 01 Jun 2021 19:15:29 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>

??????,

"??????????" ? ??????????? ? ??????? ?? ???????????. ??? ???????????? ????? ?????? ?? ????? ???????. ????? ?? ??? ? ?????????, ?????? ? ????????.

????????? ??? ?????????, ? ??????????? ?? ????????? ? ?????????? ??????????? ?????????? ?????????.

??????? ? ??????? ????????.

??????, ?? ? ?? ???? ???????? ?

???????? ?? ??????? ?????, ???????? ???-???? ???????, ??? ??? ??? ???.

1 ?????? 2021, 18:58:43, ??? "Stesin" <stesin at gmail.com>:

On Tue, 25 May 2021 at 21:05, Maksym Tulyuk <maksym at tulyuk.com> wrote:
>
> ?? ? ????? ???????????, ??? ??? ???? ????? ??????? ?? ?????????? ?, ???????, ??????? networking, ??? ?? ????????? 100% ?????????? ????

????? "??????????" (?????? ? ????. testing) ? ??????? ????? ??????,
??? "?????????".

????????? ?????????? ?? ????????? ?????????. ???? ????????? ??? ?
???????, ?? ??? ?? "?????????", ? ????????.

????????? ?????? ???? ?????: ?????????? (unit testing, load test, ...)
? ??????????? (integration testing).

? ???????: ????????? ?????????? ?? ???????????? ???????????. ???? ???
??????????????? ??????????, ?????????? ????????? ????????? ?????????
?? ???????????? ????.

?????:
- ??? ?????????? - ??? ????????? ?????????,
- ??? ????????? - ??? ?????????,
- ??? ????????? - ??? ????????? ????????? ? ???????? ????????, ?? ????
? ??? ?? ??? ??? ??????? ??????? ?? ??????? ????? ???????????
_______________________________________________
uanog mailing list
uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
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From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 21:37:38 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 21:37:38 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
 <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>

??????!

On Tue, 1 Jun 2021 at 19:15, Vladimir Sharun <vladimir.sharun at ukr.net> wrote:
>
> ??????,
>
> "??????????" ? ??????????? ? ??????? ?? ???????????.

? ?????? ?? ??? ? ??????. ??? ????? ? ?????????? ?????? ? ???????????,
??? ????????? ??????.

> ??? ???????????? ????? ?????? ?? ????? ???????.

? ??? ?? ?????? ?????????? testing ?? "?????????" ? ????????? ????
34.603? ????? ??? ?????????? ?????? ? ???????????? ??? ?????-??
??????, ?? ???-?? ????????????? ??????? ?????? ???????????? ? ??????,
?? ??? ????? ?????, ??? ?????? ?????? ? ??? ?????? ????? ??? ???????
???????? ??????????? ? ??????? ???????. ?? ???????. ?? ?????? *??
????* ???????? ??????? ? ?????? ????????? ?????????????, ????????????.

> ????????? ??? ?????????, ? ??????????? ?? ????????? ? ?????????? ??????????? ?????????? ?????????.

?? ??? ?????????, ??? ????? ????????. ??? ? ?????????? ????? ????
????? ???????? ? ??????? ????????? ???????, ? ? ????? - ????? ????
????? ?? ??? ?????? ?????.

??? ?????? ????????????? - ? ?????????? ???? ??????? power, authority,
enforcement, rule ? ??? ?????????, ? ? ????? ???? ????? "??????". ??
??? ?????? ?????.

> ???????? ?? ??????? ?????, ???????? ???-???? ???????, ??? ??? ??? ???.

? ?????? ? ???? ? ?????? ???????? ?? ???? ????? 34, ? ??????? ?? ???
??????? ? 1985. ? ???????????? ??????. ????? ????????? ?????? ?
waterfall.

? ???? ?? ???? ??????? ??? ? ??? ????? ??????? ? ?????? ??????? ? ???
????? ?? ????, ?? ???????? ? ?????? ??????? ????? ???????? ???? ??
????? ????????????? ?????? ????????. ??? ? ????, ????????? ? ??????,
???????? ?? ? ??? ?? ?? ????? ?????. netch@ ??????? ???? ?????????? ??
uanog@ - ??????? ???????????.

? ??????????, ?

From netch at netch.kiev.ua  Tue Jun  1 22:41:04 2021
From: netch at netch.kiev.ua (Valentin Nechayev)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 22:41:04 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
 <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20210601194104.GO633539@netch.kiev.ua>

hi,

 Tue, Jun 01, 2021 at 21:37:38, stesin wrote about "Re: [uanog] ???????? OVH ? ?????? :-)": 

> > "??????????" ? ??????????? ? ??????? ?? ???????????.
> 
> ? ?????? ?? ??? ? ??????. ??? ????? ? ?????????? ?????? ? ???????????,
> ??? ????????? ??????.

? ???? ????????? ????????????? ? ???, ??? ????? ?????, ??? ??????????
?? ????? ? ??? ?????, ?? ?? ???? ????????? ?????? ? ?????
??????????????????? ? ?????? ?????????.

?? ?????, ???????, ??????????? ?????????, ??? ? "?????????", ? "????"
? "?????????????" ??? ????? ?????? ????? ?????????? ?? ???? ???? ? ??
?? - ? ??? ???? ???? ????? ????? ??? ????????? ???????????.

?? ? ? ???? 34.603, ??????, ?? ?????? ??? ????????? (????????????,
whatever) ??? ?????????? ? ?????? ??????? - ? ??? ??? ????-??
?????-????? ?????????? ???? ?????????? ????? (?? ? ??? ?????, ???? ?
????????, ?????????, ???? ?? ?????? ?? ????????????).
?????? ? ?? ???? ?????????? ???? ?? ?????? ???-?? ??????????
??????. ????? ???????????? ?? ???? (? ????? ????????? ???????, ?????,
??????? ?? ??? ????? ??????????).

> > ????????? ??? ?????????, ? ??????????? ?? ????????? ? ?????????? ??????????? ?????????? ?????????.
> 
> ?? ??? ?????????, ??? ????? ????????. ??? ? ?????????? ????? ????
> ????? ???????? ? ??????? ????????? ???????, ? ? ????? - ????? ????
> ????? ?? ??? ?????? ?????.

?????? ? ? ???? ???????, ? ? ?????? (???? ? ?????????? ???? ? ???????
???????????? ??????).

> ??? ?????? ????????????? - ? ?????????? ???? ??????? power, authority,
> enforcement, rule ? ??? ?????????, ? ? ????? ???? ????? "??????". ??
> ??? ?????? ?????.

??????, ?????????, ??????????, ????, ???????, ???????????, ???????...
??? ????????? ?????? ?? ?????.

??? ???????? faith/religion/belief/trust ????????? ???????, ??.

> > ???????? ?? ??????? ?????, ???????? ???-???? ???????, ??? ??? ??? ???.
> 
> ? ?????? ? ???? ? ?????? ???????? ?? ???? ????? 34, ? ??????? ?? ???
> ??????? ? 1985. ? ???????????? ??????. ????? ????????? ?????? ?
> waterfall.
> 
> ? ???? ?? ???? ??????? ??? ? ??? ????? ??????? ? ?????? ??????? ? ???
> ????? ?? ????, ?? ???????? ? ?????? ??????? ????? ???????? ???? ??
> ????? ????????????? ?????? ????????. ??? ? ????, ????????? ? ??????,
> ???????? ?? ? ??? ?? ?? ????? ?????. netch@ ??????? ???? ?????????? ??
> uanog@ - ??????? ???????????.

??...
???????? nomail ?? ????? - ??? ??????? write-only, ???????? ?????? ??
??????. ?????? ?????????.

?? ?... ??? ???????. ?? ???? ?????? ??????????, ? ?????? ????????.
?? ??????????? - ?????????? ??????? ???.

... ? ????? ? ??? ?? ?????, ???? ??????????? ...


-netch-

From netch at netch.kiev.ua  Tue Jun  1 22:46:26 2021
From: netch at netch.kiev.ua (Valentin Nechayev)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 22:46:26 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JrQsNC20LXRgtGB0Y8sINC80Ysg0L3QsNC60LDQvdGD?=
 =?utf-8?b?0L3QtSDQs9GA0LDQvdC00LjQvtC30L3QvtCz0L4g0YjRg9GF0LXRgNCwLi4u?=
 =?utf-8?b?INC/0YDQuNCy0LXRgiBJbnRlbC4uLg==?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFshphR+Ha7vbTWsFSMQtaXp-+0EXQ-YUKMfF_uFEjtUNA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFtcFprrZYrG8UBYzfGhSsR4t6ng98rcNyM2SE2GQiezjQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <20210601155307.GN633539@netch.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFshphR+Ha7vbTWsFSMQtaXp-+0EXQ-YUKMfF_uFEjtUNA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20210601194626.GP633539@netch.kiev.ua>

hi,

 Tue, Jun 01, 2021 at 19:01:47, stesin wrote about "Re: [uanog] ???????, ?? ???????? ???????????? ??????... ?????? Intel...": 

> ???????, ???? ?? ??????? ???-?? ??? ???? ??? ???...

????? ??? ??? - ??? ??????.

> (??????, ? ??? ??? ??? meltdown/spectre, ?????? ??????? ? ?????
> ???????? ????????? mitigations, ??????????? ?????????????????? CPU ??
> ????? - ? ??????????-?? ???????? ???? ????? ????? - ???????? ???????
> ??, ? ???????, ??? "?? ????????" ?? ????????, ??? ?? ?? ????, ?? ????
> ?????????-?? ?????)

??? Meltdown ? ????? ????? ??? ?? ???????. Spectre V1, ???????, ????.
?? V2 ????? ?????? "????? ????????".


-netch-

From stesin at gmail.com  Tue Jun  1 23:33:48 2021
From: stesin at gmail.com (Stesin)
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 23:33:48 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <20210601194104.GO633539@netch.kiev.ua>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
 <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
 <20210601194104.GO633539@netch.kiev.ua>
Message-ID: <CAGNmsFvMgAKTH3YKkLWJRSn0t14HbQjJr=vpnUpzbizANxE6Ug@mail.gmail.com>

??????!

On Tue, 1 Jun 2021 at 22:41, Valentin Nechayev <netch at netch.kiev.ua> wrote:
> ?? ?????, ???????, ??????????? ?????????, ??? ? "?????????", ? "????"
> ? "?????????????" ??? ????? ?????? ????? ?????????? ?? ???? ???? ? ??
> ?? - ? ??? ???? ???? ????? ????? ??? ????????? ???????????.

????????? - ??. ?????????? - ??? ??????. ???? ??????? ????????
RUP/OpenUP, ???? ?????? waterfall, ? ???? ?????? Scrum. ??????????????
??? ?????????? ???????? ?????????? testing ????????? ??????????.

> ?? ? ? ???? 34.603, ??????, ?? ?????? ??? ????????? (????????????,
> whatever) ??? ?????????? ? ?????? ??????? - ? ??? ??? ????-??

??? ???? ??? ??????, ????? ??? ???? ????? waterfall ?? ?????. ???
?????? ?? *??????????* ?????????, ????? ?????? ??? ??????? ??????????
??????????. ? ????? ???????? - ???????? ??????????? ??????????
????????? ??, ????? ??????????? ??? ? ?????? ????????. ????? ????????
???. ??? ???? ?? ????.

?? ? ?? ????? ???? ??????? ?????? ? ????????????, ?????? "?????????" ?
???????? ???? 34.603 ?????? ????????????? ??????? testing.

?? ??, ?????? - "?????????" ??? ????? ? "acceptance testing".

> ?????-????? ?????????? ???? ?????????? ????? (?? ? ??? ?????, ???? ?
> ????????, ?????????, ???? ?? ?????? ?? ????????????).
> ?????? ? ?? ???? ?????????? ???? ?? ?????? ???-?? ??????????
> ??????. ????? ???????????? ?? ???? (? ????? ????????? ???????, ?????,
> ??????? ?? ??? ????? ??????????).

? ???? ?????, ????? ??? ? ????????????. ???? ???? ?????? ???
?????????????????? ??????????? ?? ??? ?????? ?? ????? ??????? ????????
?? ????????? ??????, ??? ?? ?????????. ???????, ?? ???? ? ??? ?????.

> > > ????????? ??? ?????????, ? ??????????? ?? ????????? ? ?????????? ??????????? ?????????? ?????????.
> >
> > ?? ??? ?????????, ??? ????? ????????. ??? ? ?????????? ????? ????
> > ????? ???????? ? ??????? ????????? ???????, ? ? ????? - ????? ????
> > ????? ?? ??? ?????? ?????.
>
> ?????? ? ? ???? ???????, ? ? ?????? (???? ? ?????????? ???? ? ???????
> ???????????? ??????).

??? ?? ? "????????????" ??????, ? ? ?????????, ? ? ?????? ????? - ???
? ? ?????????. ???? ? ????????????? ?????? ? ???????? ? ?????? ?????
??????? ???????????, ?? ? ??????????? ????? ??? ????? *?????????*
?????? ?? ??????, ????????? ??? ??????? ? ????? ???, ?? ? ????? ???
???? ???. ????? ????? ????? ????????.

> > ??? ?????? ????????????? - ? ?????????? ???? ??????? power, authority,
> > enforcement, rule ? ??? ?????????, ? ? ????? ???? ????? "??????". ??
> > ??? ?????? ?????.
>
> ??????, ?????????, ??????????, ????, ???????, ???????????, ???????...
> ??? ????????? ?????? ?? ?????.

?? ?? ??? ? ?? ?? ?? ?? ?????? ??????. Authority ? "?????????" -
??????? ??????. Enforcement ? "???????????" - ?????? ??????. ???.
"???????????" ??? compulsion ??????. ?? ? ??? ?????. Power ?
"??????????" - ?????? ????...

> ??? ???????? faith/religion/belief/trust ????????? ???????, ??.

??, ?????? ?????? ?? ???? ??? ? "??????" (????? ???????, ?? ? ?????
????? "??????" ??? ?? power ? ?? authority, ? ????? enforcement ? ???
??????? *???????* ? ?????, ?????? ? ???).

> ???????? nomail ?? ????? - ??? ??????? write-only, ???????? ?????? ??
> ??????. ?????? ?????????.

???????.

From doka at funlab.cc  Wed Jun  2 09:07:33 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2021 09:07:33 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
 <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <58e18e7e-dbe6-a814-cd0d-63d35103906d@funlab.cc>

On 01.06.2021 21:37, Stesin wrote:

> ???????? ???? ?? ????? ????????????? ?????? ????????. ??? ? ????, ????????? ? ??????,
> ???????? ?? ? ??? ?? ?? ????? ?????.

??????, ?? ????????? ?? ????????? ????????, ???? ???? ? ?????...

??????? ???? ?? ?????, ??? ???... ??????? ? ?.?. ????????? ? malloc'?? 
?? ???????????.


-- 
Volodymyr Litovka
   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

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From netch at netch.kiev.ua  Wed Jun  2 09:12:37 2021
From: netch at netch.kiev.ua (Valentin Nechayev)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2021 09:12:37 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <58e18e7e-dbe6-a814-cd0d-63d35103906d@funlab.cc>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
 <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
 <58e18e7e-dbe6-a814-cd0d-63d35103906d@funlab.cc>
Message-ID: <20210602061237.GQ633539@netch.kiev.ua>

 Wed, Jun 02, 2021 at 09:07:33, doka wrote about "Re: [uanog] ???????? OVH ? ?????? :-)": 

> >???????? ???? ?? ????? ????????????? ?????? ????????. ??? ? ????, ????????? ? ??????,
> >???????? ?? ? ??? ?? ?? ????? ?????.
> 
> ??????, ?? ????????? ?? ????????? ????????, ???? ???? ? ?????...
> 
> ??????? ???? ?? ?????, ??? ???... ??????? ? ?.?. ????????? ?
> malloc'?? ?? ???????????.

`rtin -g news.aioe.org` -> ukr.nodes
??? ?? ??? ??? ????? ????.


-netch-

From doka at funlab.cc  Wed Jun  2 09:13:27 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2021 09:13:27 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <20210602061237.GQ633539@netch.kiev.ua>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
 <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
 <58e18e7e-dbe6-a814-cd0d-63d35103906d@funlab.cc>
 <20210602061237.GQ633539@netch.kiev.ua>
Message-ID: <c4d8394d-9cbd-fae1-e6ff-90c28179afbd@funlab.cc>

???????!!! ???? ????? ??????? ?????????? :)

On 02.06.2021 09:12, Valentin Nechayev wrote:
>   Wed, Jun 02, 2021 at 09:07:33, doka wrote about "Re: [uanog] ???????? OVH ? ?????? :-)":
>
>>> ???????? ???? ?? ????? ????????????? ?????? ????????. ??? ? ????, ????????? ? ??????,
>>> ???????? ?? ? ??? ?? ?? ????? ?????.
>> ??????, ?? ????????? ?? ????????? ????????, ???? ???? ? ?????...
>>
>> ??????? ???? ?? ?????, ??? ???... ??????? ? ?.?. ????????? ?
>> malloc'?? ?? ???????????.
> `rtin -g news.aioe.org` -> ukr.nodes
> ??? ?? ??? ??? ????? ????.
>
>
> -netch-

-- 
Volodymyr Litovka
   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

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From netch at netch.kiev.ua  Wed Jun  2 09:21:25 2021
From: netch at netch.kiev.ua (Valentin Nechayev)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2021 09:21:25 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFvMgAKTH3YKkLWJRSn0t14HbQjJr=vpnUpzbizANxE6Ug@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
 <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
 <20210601194104.GO633539@netch.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFvMgAKTH3YKkLWJRSn0t14HbQjJr=vpnUpzbizANxE6Ug@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20210602062125.GR633539@netch.kiev.ua>

hi,

 Tue, Jun 01, 2021 at 23:33:48, stesin wrote about "Re: [uanog] ???????? OVH ? ?????? :-)": 

> > ?????? ? ? ???? ???????, ? ? ?????? (???? ? ?????????? ???? ? ???????
> > ???????????? ??????).
> 
> ??? ?? ? "????????????" ??????, ? ? ?????????, ? ? ?????? ????? - ???
> ? ? ?????????. ???? ? ????????????? ?????? ? ???????? ? ?????? ?????
> ??????? ???????????, ?? ? ??????????? ????? ??? ????? *?????????*
> ?????? ?? ??????, ????????? ??? ??????? ? ????? ???, ?? ? ????? ???
> ???? ???. ????? ????? ????? ????????.

?? ??? ?????? ? ???????? ???? ?????? ? ?????? ? ???? ????? - ???
??????? - ???????????? ?? ????????? ?????? ? ?????? ???????, ???
??????? - ???????? ?????????, ??? ???? ????? - ?????????? ????????. ?
??????????. ?? ?????????? ?? ? ?????? (?????? >90% ??????????????
???????, ??? ??? ???? ?????????; ? ??, ??? ?? ?????? ????? ??????????,
??? ????????? ?????????? ???????????? ??????), ? ? ???, ??? ??? ????
????????? ??????, ??? ? ?? ?????????? ????? ????? ???????? ???, ???
?????. ???? ???? ???-?? ???????? ????? ????????? NIH (??? ????), ???
??? ????? ???? ?? ???? ??????.

? ????? ??? ????? 1) ????????? ????? ? 2) ???????? ? ????. ??,
????????.

> > > ??? ?????? ????????????? - ? ?????????? ???? ??????? power, authority,
> > > enforcement, rule ? ??? ?????????, ? ? ????? ???? ????? "??????". ??
> > > ??? ?????? ?????.
> >
> > ??????, ?????????, ??????????, ????, ???????, ???????????, ???????...
> > ??? ????????? ?????? ?? ?????.
> 
> ?? ?? ??? ? ?? ?? ?? ?? ?????? ??????. Authority ? "?????????" -
> ??????? ??????. Enforcement ? "???????????" - ?????? ??????. ???.
> "???????????" ??? compulsion ??????. ?? ? ??? ?????. Power ?
> "??????????" - ?????? ????...

? ? ? ?? ??????? ??? ??????? 1:1. ?? ? ?? ?????. ??????? ??? ??, ???
???? ???? ?????. ? ??, ??? ????? ??????? ?????????? ????? ?????? -
????, 630 ?? ??? ??? ??????? ? ????????, ?? ??? ????????? ? ?? ???????
??????? - ?? ??? ?? ?? ? ????.


-netch-

From rad at rad.kiev.ua  Wed Jun  2 15:09:20 2021
From: rad at rad.kiev.ua (Oleksii Radetskyi)
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2021 15:09:20 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <c4d8394d-9cbd-fae1-e6ff-90c28179afbd@funlab.cc>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
 <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
 <58e18e7e-dbe6-a814-cd0d-63d35103906d@funlab.cc>
 <20210602061237.GQ633539@netch.kiev.ua>
 <c4d8394d-9cbd-fae1-e6ff-90c28179afbd@funlab.cc>
Message-ID: <CAAStqe72Zwra=mCdJ2zPvxu0t+M-hOP-LvfVFb_7MYxaC2L7AQ@mail.gmail.com>

??????!

???? ??? ?????. ? ????? google groups ??? ? ??????? ??????.
?????? ? ??????. :)
???????? ????? ???? ? relcom.wheels, ?? ????? ??? /offtopic.



On Wed, Jun 2, 2021 at 9:13 AM Volodymyr Litovka <doka at funlab.cc> wrote:

> ???????!!! ???? ????? ??????? ?????????? :)
> On 02.06.2021 09:12, Valentin Nechayev wrote:
>
>  Wed, Jun 02, 2021 at 09:07:33, doka wrote about "Re: [uanog] ???????? OVH ? ?????? :-)":
>
>
> ???????? ???? ?? ????? ????????????? ?????? ????????. ??? ? ????, ????????? ? ??????,
> ???????? ?? ? ??? ?? ?? ????? ?????.
>
> ??????, ?? ????????? ?? ????????? ????????, ???? ???? ? ?????...
>
> ??????? ???? ?? ?????, ??? ???... ??????? ? ?.?. ????????? ?
> malloc'?? ?? ???????????.
>
> `rtin -g news.aioe.org` -> ukr.nodes
> ??? ?? ??? ??? ????? ????.
>
>
> -netch-
>
> --
> Volodymyr Litovka
>   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison
>
> _______________________________________________
> uanog mailing list
> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
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From sm at netartgroup.com  Thu Jun  3 18:26:58 2021
From: sm at netartgroup.com (Sergey Myasoedov)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2021 17:26:58 +0200
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LjQtyDRh9Cw0YLQsCBFTk9H?=
Message-ID: <747495528.20210603172658@kaa.ru>


> ?????? ?? ????????? ??????? ? ????????? ???????? ???? ??????.
> ?????????? ???????????? ?????????? ?????????? ? RIPE ??? ?????? ASN ?
> IP ??????? ??? ISP ?? ???????????????? ???????????.

??????, ??? ???


--
Sergey Myasoedov


From maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua  Thu Jun  3 18:55:12 2021
From: maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua (Max Tulyev)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2021 18:55:12 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LjQtyDRh9Cw0YLQsCBFTk9H?=
In-Reply-To: <747495528.20210603172658@kaa.ru>
References: <747495528.20210603172658@kaa.ru>
Message-ID: <67d924cf-4524-dfb3-c54b-dac4431c3aa4@netassist.kiev.ua>

??????.

???????? ????? ??? "??????????" :)

03.06.21 18:26, Sergey Myasoedov ????:
> 
>> ?????? ?? ????????? ??????? ? ????????? ???????? ???? ??????.
>> ?????????? ???????????? ?????????? ?????????? ? RIPE ??? ?????? ASN ?
>> IP ??????? ??? ISP ?? ???????????????? ???????????.
> 
> ??????, ??? ???
> 
> 
> --
> Sergey Myasoedov
> 
> _______________________________________________
> uanog mailing list
> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
> 

From vladimir.sharun at ukr.net  Thu Jun  3 19:07:56 2021
From: vladimir.sharun at ukr.net (Vladimir Sharun)
Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2021 19:07:56 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LjQtyDRh9Cw0YLQsCBFTk9H?=
In-Reply-To: <67d924cf-4524-dfb3-c54b-dac4431c3aa4@netassist.kiev.ua>
References: <747495528.20210603172658@kaa.ru>
 <67d924cf-4524-dfb3-c54b-dac4431c3aa4@netassist.kiev.ua>
Message-ID: <1622735886.805449000.r2tz6nx1@frv53.fwdcdn.com>

??????,

?? ??????, ??? ??? ????????, ??????? ??????? ??????????? (???????????? ??????) ? ????? ??????? ? ?????????????? ????????????? - ? ?????? (??? ??????? ???? ? ??? ??????? AS? ??? ?????????, ????? ??? ????????????? ?????? ? RIPEdb ? ?????? ?????????? ?????????????). RIPE'? ??? ?????? ???????? ???????? ? ???????.

?? ???? ??????????.

PS: ??????? ???????????? ?? ????? ?????????? ????? ???????, ?? ????????? ??????, ?? ??????? ??????????.

3 ?????? 2021, 18:55:22, ??? "Max Tulyev" <maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua>:

??????.

???????? ????? ??? "??????????" :)

03.06.21 18:26, Sergey Myasoedov ????:
> 
>> ?????? ?? ????????? ??????? ? ????????? ???????? ???? ??????.
>> ?????????? ???????????? ?????????? ?????????? ? RIPE ??? ?????? ASN ?
>> IP ??????? ??? ISP ?? ???????????????? ???????????.
> 
> ??????, ??? ???
> 
> 
> --
> Sergey Myasoedov
> 
> _______________________________________________
> uanog mailing list
> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
> 
_______________________________________________
uanog mailing list
uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
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From maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua  Thu Jun  3 19:38:28 2021
From: maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua (Max Tulyev)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2021 19:38:28 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LjQtyDRh9Cw0YLQsCBFTk9H?=
In-Reply-To: <1622735886.805449000.r2tz6nx1@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
References: <747495528.20210603172658@kaa.ru>
 <67d924cf-4524-dfb3-c54b-dac4431c3aa4@netassist.kiev.ua>
 <1622735886.805449000.r2tz6nx1@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
Message-ID: <2b106a9d-41c5-929c-4a66-e507db77f284@netassist.kiev.ua>

??????,

?????????? ?????? ??????????? ???????? LIR'?? ? "????????" ???/???.

03.06.21 19:07, Vladimir Sharun ????:
> ??????,
> 
> ?? ??????, ??? ??? ????????, ??????? ??????? ??????????? (???????????? 
> ??????) ? ????? ??????? ? ?????????????? ????????????? - ? ?????? (??? 
> ??????? ???? ? ??? ??????? AS? ??? ?????????, ????? ??? ????????????? 
> ?????? ? RIPEdb ? ?????? ?????????? ?????????????). RIPE'? ??? ?????? 
> ???????? ???????? ? ???????.
> 
> ?? ???? ??????????.
> 
> PS: ??????? ???????????? ?? ????? ?????????? ????? ???????, ?? ????????? 
> ??????, ?? ??????? ??????????.
> 
> /3 ?????? 2021, 18:55:22, ??? "Max Tulyev" <maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua 
> <mailto:maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua>>:/
> 
>     ??????.
> 
>     ???????? ????? ??? "??????????" :)
> 
>     03.06.21 18:26, Sergey Myasoedov ????:
>     > 
>     >> ?????? ?? ????????? ??????? ? ????????? ???????? ???? ??????.
>     >> ?????????? ???????????? ?????????? ?????????? ? RIPE ??? ?????? ASN ?
>     >> IP ??????? ??? ISP ?? ???????????????? ???????????.
>     > 
>     > ??????, ??? ???
>     > 
>     > 
>     > --
>     > Sergey Myasoedov
>     > 
>     > _______________________________________________
>     > uanog mailing list
>     > uanog at uanog.kiev.ua  <mailto:uanog at uanog.kiev.ua>
>     > https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog  <https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog>
>     > 
>     _______________________________________________
>     uanog mailing list
>     uanog at uanog.kiev.ua  <mailto:uanog at uanog.kiev.ua>
>     https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog  <https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog>
> 

From sm at netartgroup.com  Thu Jun  3 19:59:04 2021
From: sm at netartgroup.com (Sergey Myasoedov)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2021 18:59:04 +0200
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LjQtyDRh9Cw0YLQsCBFTk9H?=
In-Reply-To: <2b106a9d-41c5-929c-4a66-e507db77f284@netassist.kiev.ua>
References: <747495528.20210603172658@kaa.ru> 
 <67d924cf-4524-dfb3-c54b-dac4431c3aa4@netassist.kiev.ua>
 <1622735886.805449000.r2tz6nx1@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <2b106a9d-41c5-929c-4a66-e507db77f284@netassist.kiev.ua>
Message-ID: <1706663581.20210603185904@kaa.ru>


RIPE NCC ???? ? ????????? ?? ??????? ?????????. ? ?? ?????? ??? ???...

?? ???? ???????? - ??? ? ????????? ????? ????? ????????????
??????????? ?????. ?? ?? ?????????? ?? LIR?? ?? ??????, ?????.


--
Sergey Myasoedov


Thursday, June 3, 2021, 18:38:28, you wrote:

MT> ??????,

MT> ?????????? ?????? ??????????? ???????? LIR'?? ? "????????" ???/???.

MT> 03.06.21 19:07, Vladimir Sharun ????:
>> ??????,
>> 
>> ?? ??????, ??? ??? ????????, ??????? ??????? ??????????? (???????????? 
>> ??????) ? ????? ??????? ? ?????????????? ????????????? - ? ?????? (??? 
>> ??????? ???? ? ??? ??????? AS? ??? ?????????, ????? ??? ????????????? 
>> ?????? ? RIPEdb ? ?????? ?????????? ?????????????). RIPE'? ??? ?????? 
>> ???????? ???????? ? ???????.
>> 
>> ?? ???? ??????????.
>> 
>> PS: ??????? ???????????? ?? ????? ?????????? ????? ???????, ?? ????????? 
>> ??????, ?? ??????? ??????????.
>> 
>> /3 ?????? 2021, 18:55:22, ??? "Max Tulyev" <maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua 
>> <mailto:maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua>>:/
>> 
>>     ??????.
>> 
>>     ???????? ????? ??? "??????????" :)
>> 
>>     03.06.21 18:26, Sergey Myasoedov ????:
>>     > 
>>     >> ?????? ?? ????????? ??????? ? ????????? ???????? ???? ??????.
>>     >> ?????????? ???????????? ?????????? ?????????? ? RIPE ??? ?????? ASN ?
>>     >> IP ??????? ??? ISP ?? ???????????????? ???????????.
>>     > 
>>     > ??????, ??? ???
>>     > 
>>     > 
>>     > --
>>     > Sergey Myasoedov
>>     > 
>>     > _______________________________________________
>>     > uanog mailing list
>>     > uanog at uanog.kiev.ua  <mailto:uanog at uanog.kiev.ua>
>>     > https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog  <https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog>
>>     > 
>>     _______________________________________________
>>     uanog mailing list
>>     uanog at uanog.kiev.ua  <mailto:uanog at uanog.kiev.ua>
>>     https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog  <https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog>
>> 
MT> _______________________________________________
MT> uanog mailing list
MT> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
MT> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog


From maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua  Thu Jun  3 20:38:01 2021
From: maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua (Max Tulyev)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2021 20:38:01 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LjQtyDRh9Cw0YLQsCBFTk9H?=
In-Reply-To: <1706663581.20210603185904@kaa.ru>
References: <747495528.20210603172658@kaa.ru>
 <67d924cf-4524-dfb3-c54b-dac4431c3aa4@netassist.kiev.ua>
 <1622735886.805449000.r2tz6nx1@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <2b106a9d-41c5-929c-4a66-e507db77f284@netassist.kiev.ua>
 <1706663581.20210603185904@kaa.ru>
Message-ID: <a8b597a8-8f80-b43c-ebbc-ffedab0d32b1@netassist.kiev.ua>

??, ??? ?????? ??????? ??? ????: ??????? ? ?????????? ???????, ????? 
?????????? ??? ??????? ??, ??? ?? ??????? ? "???????", ???????????? ?? 
??????? ???????????? ????? ???????????? ???????????????? ??????.

03.06.21 19:59, Sergey Myasoedov ????:
> 
> RIPE NCC ???? ? ????????? ?? ??????? ?????????. ? ?? ?????? ??? ???...
> 
> ?? ???? ???????? - ??? ? ????????? ????? ????? ????????????
> ??????????? ?????. ?? ?? ?????????? ?? LIR?? ?? ??????, ?????.
> 
> 
> --
> Sergey Myasoedov
> 
> 
> Thursday, June 3, 2021, 18:38:28, you wrote:
> 
> MT> ??????,
> 
> MT> ?????????? ?????? ??????????? ???????? LIR'?? ? "????????" ???/???.
> 
> MT> 03.06.21 19:07, Vladimir Sharun ????:
>>> ??????,
>>>
>>> ?? ??????, ??? ??? ????????, ??????? ??????? ??????????? (????????????
>>> ??????) ? ????? ??????? ? ?????????????? ????????????? - ? ?????? (???
>>> ??????? ???? ? ??? ??????? AS? ??? ?????????, ????? ??? ?????????????
>>> ?????? ? RIPEdb ? ?????? ?????????? ?????????????). RIPE'? ??? ??????
>>> ???????? ???????? ? ???????.
>>>
>>> ?? ???? ??????????.
>>>
>>> PS: ??????? ???????????? ?? ????? ?????????? ????? ???????, ?? ?????????
>>> ??????, ?? ??????? ??????????.
>>>
>>> /3 ?????? 2021, 18:55:22, ??? "Max Tulyev" <maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua
>>> <mailto:maxtul at netassist.kiev.ua>>:/
>>>
>>>      ??????.
>>>
>>>      ???????? ????? ??? "??????????" :)
>>>
>>>      03.06.21 18:26, Sergey Myasoedov ????:
>>>      >
>>>      >> ?????? ?? ????????? ??????? ? ????????? ???????? ???? ??????.
>>>      >> ?????????? ???????????? ?????????? ?????????? ? RIPE ??? ?????? ASN ?
>>>      >> IP ??????? ??? ISP ?? ???????????????? ???????????.
>>>      >
>>>      > ??????, ??? ???
>>>      >
>>>      >
>>>      > --
>>>      > Sergey Myasoedov
>>>      >
>>>      > _______________________________________________
>>>      > uanog mailing list
>>>      > uanog at uanog.kiev.ua  <mailto:uanog at uanog.kiev.ua>
>>>      > https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog  <https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog>
>>>      >
>>>      _______________________________________________
>>>      uanog mailing list
>>>      uanog at uanog.kiev.ua  <mailto:uanog at uanog.kiev.ua>
>>>      https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog  <https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog>
>>>
> MT> _______________________________________________
> MT> uanog mailing list
> MT> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> MT> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
> 
> 

From tasic at academ.kiev.ua  Thu Jun  3 20:59:24 2021
From: tasic at academ.kiev.ua (Taras Heichenko)
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2021 20:59:24 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JzQuNCz0YDQsNGG0LjRjyBPVkgg0LIg0L7QsdC70LA=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LrQviA6LSk=?=
In-Reply-To: <20210601194104.GO633539@netch.kiev.ua>
References: <1415019106.20210311090627@euro.net.ua>
 <7A3F6C99-27F2-4D12-9DFF-0A1866DC0462@academ.kiev.ua>
 <CAGNmsFuVvtq8zZ9empuaGZV+VV5bo8McCNm2Od2xKSsGrAMCRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <504e2a00-87bb-41f6-8110-0e9b590b2a2b@Spark>
 <CAGNmsFuCFQOk7t40LEsLkBDC+fKxknXAQ4OuGjnQJ7V4Gy_daA@mail.gmail.com>
 <1622563503.460352000.nducnaam@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFsWPf_MNdDA5aJwop66KREhZ4F0-Q_tqqCHqmmPnHT51A@mail.gmail.com>
 <20210601194104.GO633539@netch.kiev.ua>
Message-ID: <48D4418C-F6AC-4444-B852-6DBF1E260FD2@academ.kiev.ua>

Hi!

> 
> ??? ???????? faith/religion/belief/trust ????????? ???????, ??.

?? ????? ????/???????/?????????/???????

> 
> 
> 
> -netch-
> _______________________________________________
> uanog mailing list
> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog

--
Taras Heichenko
tasic at academ.kiev.ua






From alex at euro.net.ua  Tue Jun  8 17:05:32 2021
From: alex at euro.net.ua (Alexander V Soroka)
Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2021 17:05:32 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?cp1251?b?wiDs6PDlIO/w7ujn7vjl6yDs4PH48uDh7fvpIPHh7ukg?=
 =?cp1251?b?4iDw4OHu8uUg6vDz7+379SDRzMgg6CDx5fDi6PHu4g==?=
Message-ID: <191816659.20210608170532@euro.net.ua>

?????? !

???????? :-) ??? ???????????

https://news.obozrevatel.com/tech/v-mire-proizoshel-masshtabnyij-sboj-v-rabote-krupnyih-smi-i-servisov.htm

? ???? ????????? ?????????? ???? ? ?????? ??????? ??? ? ????????

? ?????? ??????? ??????? ??? ? ???????? ??????????? ????. ? ?????????,
?????????   ???????????   Reddit,  GitHub,  Twitch,  Spotify  ?  Stack
Overflow.

???  ????????  TechCrunch,  ????  ??????????  ?????  ?????  ??????????
???????  ???  ?  The Guardian, The New York Times, BBC, CNN, Financial
Times ? ??????.

????? ????, ?? ??????? ??? ???????????? ????????.

?????? ????? ???????? ?????? 503. ??? ????????, ??? ??????, ?? ???????
?????????? ??????, ? ?????? ?????? ?? ????? ?????????? ????? ??????? ?
???? ??????.

??  ????  ?????????,  ????  ???????  ? ?????????? ? ?????? ???????????
CDN-?????????? Fastly.  https://status.fastly.com/

-- 
Best regards,
Alexander V Soroka       http://www.svr.ua/
AS106-RIPE
mailto:alex at euro.net.ua    


From misha at rattler.kiev.ua  Tue Jun  8 23:13:31 2021
From: misha at rattler.kiev.ua (Michael Bochkaryov)
Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2021 23:13:31 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0JIg0LzQuNGA0LUg0L/RgNC+0LjQt9C+0YjQtdC7INC8?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LDRgdGI0YLQsNCx0L3Ri9C5INGB0LHQvtC5INCyINGA0LDQsdC+0YI=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LUg0LrRgNGD0L/QvdGL0YUg0KHQnNCYINC4INGB0LXRgNCy0LjRgdC+?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LI=?=
In-Reply-To: <191816659.20210608170532@euro.net.ua>
References: <191816659.20210608170532@euro.net.ua>
Message-ID: <CAExkHc19phT=ODtW9BrHjF1RYAGn4dbBO0ao+vCJMT+ZLqU2rw@mail.gmail.com>

?? ?? "?? ???? ?????????", ? ???? Fastly ??????????.
Incident report: https://status.fastly.com/incidents/vpk0ssybt3bj

?????? ???? ?? ????: Vast chunks of the internet is down. Since
StackOverflow is also down, engineers can't fix these issues.

Regards,
Michael Bochkaryov



On Tue, Jun 8, 2021 at 5:05 PM Alexander V Soroka <alex at euro.net.ua> wrote:

> ?????? !
>
> ???????? :-) ??? ???????????
>
>
> https://news.obozrevatel.com/tech/v-mire-proizoshel-masshtabnyij-sboj-v-rabote-krupnyih-smi-i-servisov.htm
>
> ? ???? ????????? ?????????? ???? ? ?????? ??????? ??? ? ????????
>
> ? ?????? ??????? ??????? ??? ? ???????? ??????????? ????. ? ?????????,
> ?????????   ???????????   Reddit,  GitHub,  Twitch,  Spotify  ?  Stack
> Overflow.
>
> ???  ????????  TechCrunch,  ????  ??????????  ?????  ?????  ??????????
> ???????  ???  ?  The Guardian, The New York Times, BBC, CNN, Financial
> Times ? ??????.
>
> ????? ????, ?? ??????? ??? ???????????? ????????.
>
> ?????? ????? ???????? ?????? 503. ??? ????????, ??? ??????, ?? ???????
> ?????????? ??????, ? ?????? ?????? ?? ????? ?????????? ????? ??????? ?
> ???? ??????.
>
> ??  ????  ?????????,  ????  ???????  ? ?????????? ? ?????? ???????????
> CDN-?????????? Fastly.  https://status.fastly.com/
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Alexander V Soroka       http://www.svr.ua/
> AS106-RIPE
> mailto:alex at euro.net.ua
>
> _______________________________________________
> uanog mailing list
> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
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From netch at netch.kiev.ua  Sun Jun 13 10:10:49 2021
From: netch at netch.kiev.ua (Valentin Nechayev)
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 2021 10:10:49 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20210613071049.GB110682@netch.kiev.ua>

hi,

 Mon, May 24, 2021 at 14:36:53, stesin wrote about "Re: [uanog] dual homing ???? ? ???????? WiFi": 

> > ??? ?????????? IT ?????????????? ?????????? ?????
> >
> > ?????????? ??????? ??? ??? ?????.
> 
> ???????? ??? ???? ???????? ????? ??????????.

?????? ? ???? ?????? ?? ????/etc. (??????? ????? ?? ????????????) -
????.
?? ??????? ??-????????, ??, ?? ??? ???? ?? ??? ?????????? ?? ??? ???.


-netch-

From doka at funlab.cc  Mon Jun 14 14:46:19 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 2021 14:46:19 +0300
Subject: [uanog] WLC2504
Message-ID: <9fd84307-5bbe-e9c4-4a01-fbe97e2ce73e@funlab.cc>

??????,

? ? ???? ? ????????? ???? ??????? cisco 2504 WLC ??????? ????? ??????? ? 
????????????????, ????? ? ? ????? ?????? ??????????? ??????? ? ?? ???? 
??? ??????????? ?????, ? ????????, ??????, ?????? ?????????, ??? ??? 
?????????? ??? ?????????????? ???-?? ? ? ?????????? ???????? - ??? 
?????? ???????????, ? ??? ??? - ???????? ???????. ??????? ?????????? ?? 
???????? ???????.

???????.

-- 
Volodymyr Litovka
   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

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From lystor at gmail.com  Mon Jun 14 15:24:54 2021
From: lystor at gmail.com (Mykola Ulianytskyi)
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 2021 15:24:54 +0300
Subject: [uanog] WLC2504
In-Reply-To: <9fd84307-5bbe-e9c4-4a01-fbe97e2ce73e@funlab.cc>
References: <9fd84307-5bbe-e9c4-4a01-fbe97e2ce73e@funlab.cc>
Message-ID: <CA+Mediy_L4pZXd6Xn7b+Cj44pE8NG-rUEnqrQreVH3pQ1x5bKg@mail.gmail.com>

??????

????
https://geks0gen.blogspot.com/2013/05/hardware-cisco-wireless-controller-2504.html

--
Best regards,
Mykola

On Mon, Jun 14, 2021 at 2:46 PM Volodymyr Litovka <doka at funlab.cc> wrote:
>
> ??????,
>
> ? ? ???? ? ????????? ???? ??????? cisco 2504 WLC ??????? ????? ??????? ? ????????????????, ????? ? ? ????? ?????? ??????????? ??????? ? ?? ???? ??? ??????????? ?????, ? ????????, ??????, ?????? ?????????, ??? ??? ?????????? ??? ?????????????? ???-?? ? ? ?????????? ???????? - ??? ?????? ???????????, ? ??? ??? - ???????? ???????. ??????? ?????????? ?? ???????? ???????.
>
> ???????.
>
> --
> Volodymyr Litovka
>   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison
>
> _______________________________________________
> uanog mailing list
> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog

From doka at funlab.cc  Mon Jun 14 15:25:46 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 2021 15:25:46 +0300
Subject: [uanog] WLC2504
In-Reply-To: <CA+Mediy_L4pZXd6Xn7b+Cj44pE8NG-rUEnqrQreVH3pQ1x5bKg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <9fd84307-5bbe-e9c4-4a01-fbe97e2ce73e@funlab.cc>
 <CA+Mediy_L4pZXd6Xn7b+Cj44pE8NG-rUEnqrQreVH3pQ1x5bKg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <717355a5-c7b5-4bde-7ffc-1ffc953ce1d8@funlab.cc>

??,

????? ???? WLC5508 :)

On 14.06.2021 15:24, Mykola Ulianytskyi wrote:
> ??????
>
> ????
> https://geks0gen.blogspot.com/2013/05/hardware-cisco-wireless-controller-2504.html
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Mykola
>
> On Mon, Jun 14, 2021 at 2:46 PM Volodymyr Litovka <doka at funlab.cc> wrote:
>> ??????,
>>
>> ? ? ???? ? ????????? ???? ??????? cisco 2504 WLC ??????? ????? ??????? ? ????????????????, ????? ? ? ????? ?????? ??????????? ??????? ? ?? ???? ??? ??????????? ?????, ? ????????, ??????, ?????? ?????????, ??? ??? ?????????? ??? ?????????????? ???-?? ? ? ?????????? ???????? - ??? ?????? ???????????, ? ??? ??? - ???????? ???????. ??????? ?????????? ?? ???????? ???????.
>>
>> ???????.
>>
>> --
>> Volodymyr Litovka
>>    "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> uanog mailing list
>> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
>> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog

-- 
Volodymyr Litovka
   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

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From edigarov at qarea.com  Wed Jun 16 10:40:21 2021
From: edigarov at qarea.com (Gregory Edigarov)
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 10:40:21 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LPRg9Cz0LssINC80LzQsNGC0Ywg0LXQs9C+INC30LAg?=
	=?utf-8?b?0L3QvtCz0YMu?=
Message-ID: <6cdc25cf-b5b5-157a-ad37-287f3028a6ff@qarea.com>

?????? ????,

? ??? ?????, ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ??????????, ?????? ? ???? ???????????
? ?? ???????? ? ???? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ?????????? ?? ????????.
??????? ??????? ?? ?????,
?? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ?????? ?? ???. ? ripe ? geoip ???? ?????
???????? ?? ??????????? ????????,
??????? ???? ????? ???????, ? ???????, ????? ?? ????????? ???? ??
???????????, ???? ?? ??????????.

?? ?? ????? ??? ???? ????????, ?? ???? ??????????.

???????.

--
With best regards,
??????? Gregory Edigarov

From bogus@does.not.exist.com  Wed Jun 16 11:16:06 2021
From: bogus@does.not.exist.com ()
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 08:16:06 -0000
Subject: [uanog] (no subject)
Message-ID: <mailman.0.1623831366.461.uanog@uanog.kiev.ua>


From edigarov at qarea.com  Wed Jun 16 11:17:56 2021
From: edigarov at qarea.com (Gregory Edigarov)
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 11:17:56 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LPRg9Cz0LssINC80LzQsNGC0Ywg0LXQs9C+INC30LAg?=
	=?utf-8?b?0L3QvtCz0YMu?=
Message-ID: <ca0492d6-a783-1142-b432-c1a78e8a9704@qarea.com>

?????? ????,

? ??? ?????, ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ??????????, ?????? ? ???? ???????????
? ?? ???????? ? ???? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ?????????? ?? ????????.
??????? ??????? ?? ?????,
?? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ?????? ?? ???. ? ripe ? geoip ???? ?????
???????? ?? ??????????? ????????,
??????? ???? ????? ???????, ? ???????, ????? ?? ????????? ???? ??
???????????, ???? ?? ??????????.

?? ?? ????? ??? ???? ????????, ?? ???? ??????????.

???????.

--
With best regards,
??????? Gregory Edigarov


From abb at abbon.net  Wed Jun 16 14:12:26 2021
From: abb at abbon.net (Alexandr Baryshnyev)
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 14:12:26 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LPRg9Cz0LssINC80LzQsNGC0Ywg0LXQs9C+INC30LAg?=
 =?utf-8?b?0L3QvtCz0YMu?=
In-Reply-To: <ca0492d6-a783-1142-b432-c1a78e8a9704@qarea.com>
References: <ca0492d6-a783-1142-b432-c1a78e8a9704@qarea.com>
Message-ID: <6549f34d-24a2-179c-12dc-ed22b2d31bd6@abbon.net>

?????? ????.

?? ?????? ?????? ??????????, ????? ?????? ???????? ???????????? ? ??? ? ?????? ??????:
http://redirector.googlevideo.com/report_mapping
?? ? ?????? ??????? ????? ? ?? ?????????, ???????????? ?????. ???????? iftop - ????????? ?????????? ? ??????? ???? ??? 
???? ?????.

????????? ?????????? BGP ? DNS ??? ???????????????. ???? ??? ?? ????????? ????????, ??????? ??? ????????? ?? ?????????, 
?? ?????? ????? BGP ?????????? ???????? ???? ? ???? ? ?? ??????? ???????????? ??? ?? ????????? ????????? ? ???????? BGP 
????????. ? ????? ?????? ????????? ??????????? ??? ??? ???????. ?????????? ?????? ?????, ???? ?? ???? ???????. ?? ????? 
???????, ????????? ? ?????? - ??????????, ??? ???????? ??????? ?????? ??? ??????, ??? ? ?????.

???????!

16.06.2021 11:17, Gregory Edigarov ?????:
> ?????? ????,
> 
> ? ??? ?????, ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ??????????, ?????? ? ???? ???????????
> ? ?? ???????? ? ???? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ?????????? ?? ????????.
> ??????? ??????? ?? ?????,
> ?? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ?????? ?? ???. ? ripe ? geoip ???? ?????
> ???????? ?? ??????????? ????????,
> ??????? ???? ????? ???????, ? ???????, ????? ?? ????????? ???? ??
> ???????????, ???? ?? ??????????.
> 
> ?? ?? ????? ??? ???? ????????, ?? ???? ??????????.
> 
> ???????.
> 
> --
> With best regards,
>  ??????? Gregory Edigarov
> 
> _______________________________________________
> uanog mailing list
> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
> 

-- 
    Best regards,
    Alexandr B. Baryshnyev, e-mail: abb at abbon.net

From doka at funlab.cc  Wed Jun 16 15:57:59 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 15:57:59 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LrQvtC80YMg0LPQvtGC0L7QstGL0Lkg0LHQuNC30L0=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LXRgT8=?=
In-Reply-To: <20210615193720.ccbe793bc7ad@ekurilka.ua>
References: <20210615193720.ccbe793bc7ad@ekurilka.ua>
Message-ID: <88048cb6-356f-1f83-71c2-f5255f042eea@funlab.cc>

??????,

subj :-)


-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: 	?????? ????.
Date: 	Wed, 16 Jun 2021 15:38:09 +0300
From: 	ekurilka at ekurilka.ua <ekurilka at ekurilka.ua>



??????????? ??????????? ??????? ??????. ????? ????????? ?? ???????? 
???????? ??????????? ??????????? ????? ???? ? ?????? ????????? 
?????????????? ??? ekurilkaforum at gmail.com. ???? ???? ???? ? ??????? 
?????? ????? ???? ?????? ???????????, ????? ???????? ????? ? ???? ???? 
(? ????????, ??? ?????? ? ?????? ?? ?????, ??? ??????? ? ???????).
??????? ??????? ? ?????????? ??????? ?????????????? ?????.
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From oleh.hrynchuk at gmail.com  Wed Jun 16 18:21:31 2021
From: oleh.hrynchuk at gmail.com (Oleh Hrynchuk)
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 18:21:31 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LrQvtC80YMg0LPQvtGC0L7QstGL0Lkg0LHQuNC30L0=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LXRgT8=?=
In-Reply-To: <88048cb6-356f-1f83-71c2-f5255f042eea@funlab.cc>
References: <20210615193720.ccbe793bc7ad@ekurilka.ua>
 <88048cb6-356f-1f83-71c2-f5255f042eea@funlab.cc>
Message-ID: <CAJWhN-p5humjx1v21ow7ekRf-Jp-JP=5ru0MjMNvVAwsbaxe9g@mail.gmail.com>

?? ???? ????? ?????????? ????? ????????? ?? ????????
?????? ????? ?????????? ????-??????...

??, 16 ????. 2021 ? 15:58 Volodymyr Litovka <doka at funlab.cc> ????:

> ??????,
>
> subj :-)
>
> -------- Forwarded Message --------
> Subject: ?????? ????.
> Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2021 15:38:09 +0300
> From: ekurilka at ekurilka.ua <ekurilka at ekurilka.ua> <ekurilka at ekurilka.ua>
>
> ??????????? ??????????? ??????? ??????. ????? ????????? ?? ????????
> ???????? ??????????? ??????????? ????? ???? ? ?????? ?????????
> ?????????????? ??? ekurilkaforum at gmail.com. ???? ???? ???? ? ???????
> ?????? ????? ???? ?????? ???????????, ????? ???????? ????? ? ???? ???? (?
> ????????, ??? ?????? ? ?????? ?? ?????, ??? ??????? ? ???????).
> ??????? ??????? ? ?????????? ??????? ?????????????? ?????.
> _______________________________________________
> uanog mailing list
> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog



-- 
Regards,
/oleh hrynchuk
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From doka at funlab.cc  Thu Jun 17 01:50:36 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2021 01:50:36 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?0LrQvtC80YMg0LPQvtGC0L7QstGL0Lkg0LHQuNC30L0=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LXRgT8=?=
In-Reply-To: <CAJWhN-p5humjx1v21ow7ekRf-Jp-JP=5ru0MjMNvVAwsbaxe9g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20210615193720.ccbe793bc7ad@ekurilka.ua>
 <88048cb6-356f-1f83-71c2-f5255f042eea@funlab.cc>
 <CAJWhN-p5humjx1v21ow7ekRf-Jp-JP=5ru0MjMNvVAwsbaxe9g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f7563b0a-e5d2-0915-e63a-3287c6efcf54@funlab.cc>

?? ? ???????? - ?????? ????????? ???, ?????? ? ?????, ?????????? 
e-cigarettes. ??? ????, ??? ? ???????, ???? ???? ???????? ??????.

??? ????, ?? ????? ??????, ??????? ???? ? ???? -
??? ????? ?????? ? ??? ?????? ???? ???????? ???? ??? ??? ????? ???? ???,
??? ??? [???] ????????? ?-???????, ?????? ?????? ?? ????? ?? ???????? ? 
???? ???? ????????.

?????, ?? ?????.

On 16.06.2021 18:21, Oleh Hrynchuk wrote:
> ?? ???? ????? ?????????? ????? ????????? ?? ????????
> ?????? ????? ?????????? ????-??????...
>
> ??, 16 ????. 2021 ? 15:58 Volodymyr Litovka <doka at funlab.cc> ????:
>
>     ??????,
>
>     subj :-)
>
>
>     -------- Forwarded Message --------
>     Subject: 	?????? ????.
>     Date: 	Wed, 16 Jun 2021 15:38:09 +0300
>     From: 	ekurilka at ekurilka.ua <mailto:ekurilka at ekurilka.ua>
>     <ekurilka at ekurilka.ua> <mailto:ekurilka at ekurilka.ua>
>
>
>
>     ??????????? ??????????? ??????? ??????. ????? ????????? ??
>     ???????? ???????? ??????????? ??????????? ????? ???? ? ??????
>     ????????? ?????????????? ??? ekurilkaforum at gmail.com
>     <mailto:ekurilkaforum at gmail.com>. ???? ???? ???? ? ??????? ??????
>     ????? ???? ?????? ???????????, ????? ???????? ????? ? ???? ???? (?
>     ????????, ??? ?????? ? ?????? ?? ?????, ??? ??????? ? ???????).
>     ??????? ??????? ? ?????????? ??????? ?????????????? ?????.
>     _______________________________________________
>     uanog mailing list
>     uanog at uanog.kiev.ua <mailto:uanog at uanog.kiev.ua>
>     https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
>     <https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Regards,
> /oleh hrynchuk

-- 
Volodymyr Litovka
   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

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From paveln at gmail.com  Thu Jun 17 12:47:46 2021
From: paveln at gmail.com (Pavlo Narozhnyy)
Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2021 12:47:46 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
	=?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <20210613071049.GB110682@netch.kiev.ua>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <20210613071049.GB110682@netch.kiev.ua>
Message-ID: <CAOXbUYHXxx493jeHvvmK=UbYRLR2yjykygYrTLiZYjocMSNbhw@mail.gmail.com>

? ?? ????? ?????? ????? ???????? ????????? ??????? ??? ????
??????????, ? ?? ? ??? ?? ? ?????.

??, 13 ????. 2021 ? 10:10 Valentin Nechayev <netch at netch.kiev.ua> ????:
>
> hi,
>
>  Mon, May 24, 2021 at 14:36:53, stesin wrote about "Re: [uanog] dual homing ???? ? ???????? WiFi":
>
> > > ??? ?????????? IT ?????????????? ?????????? ?????
> > >
> > > ?????????? ??????? ??? ??? ?????.
> >
> > ???????? ??? ???? ???????? ????? ??????????.
>
> ?????? ? ???? ?????? ?? ????/etc. (??????? ????? ?? ????????????) -
> ????.
> ?? ??????? ??-????????, ??, ?? ??? ???? ?? ??? ?????????? ?? ??? ???.
>
>
> -netch-
> _______________________________________________
> uanog mailing list
> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog



-- 

Pavlo Narozhnyy
+380 95 276 31 46
https://www.techniqtrading.com/

From doka at funlab.cc  Thu Jun 17 15:30:07 2021
From: doka at funlab.cc (Volodymyr Litovka)
Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2021 15:30:07 +0300
Subject: [uanog] =?utf-8?b?ZHVhbCBob21pbmcg0LTQvtC80LAg0YEg0L3QsNC00LU=?=
 =?utf-8?b?0LbQvdGL0LwgV2lGaQ==?=
In-Reply-To: <CAOXbUYHXxx493jeHvvmK=UbYRLR2yjykygYrTLiZYjocMSNbhw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGNmsFujmxviDpuuaM=u+9dCKW3DFJXnzhbhoCGCCKCLUtWiFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <33A7C58B-6226-4A28-B72B-E2F464137775@farm.org>
 <CACVfVFtrsr1rjw1WB=SFzz+ZY1QzCzv=wB2hW5=zay2tUGCn3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFvB=Goy2BKtcPU=1O39PdGooJLK9bjg-2hzbhr6d7DS9g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACVfVFsCFaxwgzaRatLCUB7SyZ_es6612x6S24mOE8u22xfCvw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGNmsFu2mLes=zBO8HHpkGGU=FE9wy6fniNKQTe9R=tAHVaALQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621847402.335647000.i9slvakm@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuDXabxaoWpgfrgotbSe0m-69gUNwYXiXfS36REOHrxZQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1621855494.315307000.nwqikmn4@frv53.fwdcdn.com>
 <CAGNmsFuNUvhpCxe+=CijMLuegnQghak09NctEQojO005HYycNg@mail.gmail.com>
 <20210613071049.GB110682@netch.kiev.ua>
 <CAOXbUYHXxx493jeHvvmK=UbYRLR2yjykygYrTLiZYjocMSNbhw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <38eff70a-9e60-f68f-59eb-0f19cadbd136@funlab.cc>

???, ??? ??, ???????? ?????? ??????. ???? ?????? ????????? ? ????? ?????? :)


:)

On 17.06.2021 12:47, Pavlo Narozhnyy wrote:
> ? ?? ????? ?????? ????? ???????? ????????? ??????? ??? ????
> ??????????, ? ?? ? ??? ?? ? ?????.
>
> ??, 13 ????. 2021 ? 10:10 Valentin Nechayev <netch at netch.kiev.ua> ????:
>> hi,
>>
>>   Mon, May 24, 2021 at 14:36:53, stesin wrote about "Re: [uanog] dual homing ???? ? ???????? WiFi":
>>
>>>> ??? ?????????? IT ?????????????? ?????????? ?????
>>>>
>>>> ?????????? ??????? ??? ??? ?????.
>>> ???????? ??? ???? ???????? ????? ??????????.
>> ?????? ? ???? ?????? ?? ????/etc. (??????? ????? ?? ????????????) -
>> ????.
>> ?? ??????? ??-????????, ??, ?? ??? ???? ?? ??? ?????????? ?? ??? ???.
>>
>>
>> -netch-
>> _______________________________________________
>> uanog mailing list
>> uanog at uanog.kiev.ua
>> https://mailman.uanog.kiev.ua/mailman/listinfo/uanog
>
>
-- 
Volodymyr Litovka
   "Vision without Execution is Hallucination." -- Thomas Edison

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From oleh.hrynchuk at gmail.com  Mon Jun 21 10:04:29 2021
From: oleh.hrynchuk at gmail.com (Oleh Hrynchuk)
Date: Mon, 21 Jun 2021 10:04:29 +0300
Subject: [uanog] Mikrotik switches CS326-24G and MAC-based ACL
Message-ID: <CAJWhN-rOSOKm43AJzV6=GpWL+A6jt_9Hhs3njyNzuwS9zrL07g@mail.gmail.com>

??????? ???, ??????? ??????.

???? ?? ???? ???????????, ?? ?????? ???????????? ??? ????????? ???? ??
?????? ???????.

??? ???? ?????? ???????: https://mikrotik.com/product/CSS326-24G-2SplusRM ?
firmware ver. 2.12
? ??? ?????? ??????: https://mikrotik.com/product/hex_s ? firmware ver.
6.47.4
??? ??? ??????? ?????????????? ?? router-on-stick

??????: ?????? ?????? ?? ethernet-?????? ??????? ???? MAC-??????? ??
??????????? ??????.

???? ???? (https://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/SwOS/CSS326#ACL_Tab), ?? ??????
???? ????? ?????????? ??????? MAC-based ACL.
??? ????? ????? ????????? ???????? ? ???????? ????????, ?? ?? ?? ?????? ??,
???? ? ????.
????? ???? ???????? ????????? ??????? ?????? ??, ?? ????????? ???? ?????
???? ?? ?????????? ????? "???????????" ?????? ? ??????? ????????????:
- Up to 32 ACL rules (limited by SwOS)

???? ????? ??? ??? ?????? ? ????? ??????? ?? ??? ????????? ???????? ???? ??
?????? ??????? ?????? "????" MAC?..

?????.

-- 
Regards,
/oleh hrynchuk
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